ever notice when you're riding your bike you dont give a sh!t. go ride you bike fellas. Disco i luv ya but you so knew what was going to take place. Since when does the pub stand for political ultimate boredom. gabe post up some non pc pics now and save the pub brutha ( b00bies, yeah)
I don't see anything in the U.S. Constitution that specifically states citizens are entitled to government funded health care.
its a def maybe tonight ..most def in the following week. if i'm running late tonight u guys doing typically loop? so i can try to catch up
I think you missed the sarcasm clause in his statement.... I think so, but some of the boys were talkin' bout doin' some DJ route. At least in that general area! Show up A!
No, the function of the government is to ALLOW the people to make the country great. If you read any of the founding fathers papers, they wanted LESS government involvement, not more. Everything is written to limit the powers of government, and have checks and balances. If we are now giving healthcare over to government, we are now slaves to government because they now basically hold our lives in their hands. There is no stopping them from limiting healthcare to enslave the people. That is the last thing the founding fathers wanted. The government is there to serve the people and fear the people. Not look after them like a parent.
truth be told i am taking my son to a late dr appt. if the dr takes us on time i may be able to make it and will bring the RIOT. any idea what the route is so again i may join if running late. btw running low tread 2.1/2.0 on the dj...should be a f'n mess for me in the loose stuff
Canada sounds like paradise. Good health care and Whistler in the summer. Unfortunately I have to have an actual job with a Canadian company to immigrate. What a bunch of control freaks. And get this - During the application process, you may be asked to undergo a medical exam and/or a criminal check. The medical exam is required to make sure that applicants do not have a medical condition that presents a danger to Canadian public health and safety, or would cause excessive demand on health or social services in Canada. The criminal check is required to prevent individuals who pose a risk to Canada’s security from entering the country
I agree with your point about compassion. I don't think anybody here wants people to suffer and not have a doctor when they need it. I know I don't. Where I differ from your point of view are in the practical factors. 1. What level of care should be provided to the populace? Is a person who otherwise can't afford medical care entitled to a yearly checkup? How about quarterly doctor visits if they feel that's what their entitled to? What if they have hemorrhoids and want them laser removed -- it isn't a life threatening condition, but it isn't pleasant either -- entitled? For the most basic life threatening human care, I don't think people living in the U.S. are regularly denied urgent service. 2. Who pays? The debate is always in the abstract about being entitled to "medical care." But there are real people whose livelihoods depend on services and products that make up this medical care. Who pays the doctors, the nurses, the records keepers for all these people we are offering compassion to? Would anybody here donate your mountain bike to pay for some random person's yearly checkup? If you aren't willing to part with your luxuries, how do justify forcing the "rich" to part with theirs? How do you factor in the four years of exorbitant debt the doctors must accept for medical school and the pittance they make for the hours they put in when they are residents? How do we reward these people who were studying while we were playing in college? Who pays the guys in the trenches who are developing new devices and drugs? How should we reward the risk takers to maintain an incentive to innovate? Who pays? The free market does the best job of answering these questions. It encourages efficiency and competition that drive prices down. Other factors, such as government mandates and awarding each victim of a doctor mistake millions of dollars is more to blame for driving up costs than corporate greed. But I agree with the general premise that in a civilized society there are incentives to keep our populace healthy and that a basic sense of human compassion wishes no ill on anybody. I just disagree that the government can outperform the private sector in providing this compassion.
i think the government should also offer free lunch, and weekly car washes. After all, i'm just pursuing happiness, thus i'm entitled to it! LESS GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT. Your government is there to prevent anarchy and establish order....protect from invasion etc...some security.. thats it
WOW! DUDE have you been to China? Have you lived there? Have you used their health system? 80% of people signed up? You my friend are putting out some very ignorant statements! #1 99% of people in China don’t sign up for nothing! They don’t have a F#$%ing choice! #2 If US has third world health care system then why all the rich people in asia fly here for their medical needs and paying cash? In case you don’t know some of the best doctors in this country has already stopped taking insurance PERIOD! #3 Those free health clinics in poor countries are never government paid, it has always been paid for private donations! I understand you are or used to be in service and use VA system and yes it does work ok. BUT do you know all the VA doctors are not paid well? Do you know why? Because they are paying for their FREE education(paid for by us). They get their free medical degree and training then provide 8 years of service to the military…..fair deal. Now do they stay out of goodness of their heart? NO……they all leave so they can make some money for their years or school and training. Without the prospect of good paying jobs outside of military no one will ever go through the trouble to be an doctors in military period! Here is point of view from someone who grew up in China. My parents were both doctors in China and were fortunate to be in a sizable city hospital with more than average resources. They were both head of their department and still don’t get paid much more than the average chen lee. I use to go to the hospital all the time because of my parents. What do I see? Patients waiting for hours sometimes days to be seen by a doctor. Even if they see the doctor they most likely don’t get the proper treatment because lack of resource and most doctors simply don’t care because they don’t make much. New equipment is basically unheard of, no additional training and updated method are even talked about less mandated. Basically the hospital give just basic treatment for basic illnesses. If you have cancer they’ll tell you how you much time you have left and go home. If you have something really nasty and painful then they’ll give you whatever they got but if that doesn’t work they just lock you in a room so you can scream till you die. The horror stories I heard from my parents are sickening. This is very recent, my grandmother was sick and all they did was giving her some I.V. and have her lay in a hospital bed for 3 days. All the tests and diagnostic we get here? Forget it, you have to ask for it and cost way more than average Ming Lee can afford. Thank goodness we can afford it but it still went nowhere! Public health system for everyone my a$$! If you prefer that then you can have it! Seriously I understand when you are in the military you do what you are told without question, well it’s time to open your eyes and ask questions!
Ken, with all due respect, your comment is ridiculous. i hardly think that the uninsured have decided to buy a Range Rover instead of health insurance. Priorities? For many, there is no money left after paying the rest of the bills. Have you seen the cost of insuring a family??! It seems that the majority of the people vehemently opposed to health care reform are those fortunate enough to be in a position of never having had to worry about health care. Consider yourself very, very lucky and pray that your financial situation doesn't change. In this climate, things can change on a dime and I wonder if you'd be singing the same tune if you were laid off and out of work for the next year - savings gone and unemployment benefits finished. I am truly disgusted by some of these comments from you people who don't think it's important to take care of our own. What are we as a country or as human beings if we stop giving a shit about others? It seems that so many of you are terrified about someone else getting some of "yours". I have no problem with Capitalism. For my car? Sure. For my mountain bike and phone service? No problem. But not as far as my health care is concerned. I'd rather not make a fat, white man rich off of my health. Our current health care system is horrible and the only ones benefiting are the pharmaceutical and insurance companies. They are a business and that alone makes it a conflict of interest as far as my health is concerned. I had an appendectomy and it took almost a year of stress and fighting with the insurance company to get the bill paid. I had excellent coverage through Blue Cross. They paid the surgeon. They paid the anesthesiologist. They paid the doctors and the nurses and for all of my medication. But they fought me on the hospital room. Apparently, I was supposed to stay outside on the sidewalk during my hospital visit. The kind lady in collections told me, "Ms. Sullivan, just keep calling Blue Cross and fighting them. They're just hoping you'll get frustrated and decide to pay it yourself." Nine months later, they finally caved and paid the hospital. There is a special place in hell for insurance companies. I made a visit to Cedars Sinai with intense stomach pain. Turns out to be an ulcer. A woman with a clipboard approached me while I was on the gurney and demanded my 200 dollar deductible before letting the doctor see me. I cut her a check, of course. Thanks Blue Cross for thinking of my health first! You rock! :bang:
"hey, you kids! get off my lawn!" the constitution didn't spell out that slavery was a bad idea either. or that women should be able to vote. so we should have private roads, parks, mail delivery, military, etc. classic libertarianism doesn't really seem to work in the real world. and, yes, a gov't should provide for it's citizens. it goes both ways in a republic. i've had more productive talks with the kids in the short bus. you guys are going to have to learn how to deal with a little change in the modern world that we live in... :lol: s'later.
Have you ever been to MLK hospital in Compton? You can witness the ridiculousness in person. It's quite disturbing. Go to the local grocery store in south central. Watching people pay with food stamps and then going outside to watch them hop into a late model Escalade on 24"s. Then have the audacity to claim hardship? I have witnessed where people will opt out of company health plans to fatten their pay check with the attitude of, " if I get sick, I'll just go to the free clinic.". I'm not saying that this is the norm, but I just wanted you to know that it exists, and not in small quantities either. Yes, I know what it costs to insure a family. I offer it to my employees.
and if universal health care is so bad and oppressive, where are all the revolts in all the countries that have it. c'mon, ken. the compton comment is just generalized scapegoating. i teach in south l.a., and 99% of our families are just trying to survive with their crappy cars and lack of insurance. but most of them do have nice shoes... it's going to a long 8 years for those of you on the right, just like the last 8 were torture, so to speak, for those of us on the left. that would be the political pendulum coming back around. :beer:
My concern is for my "fellow citizens" to use the phrase dirtvert used rather ironically. I am sure that the government can only make the situation worse. Politicians do whatever appeases the masses without regard for the consequences. They are always trying to reduce costs by (1) mandating rates or (2) rationing care. Stupid! If you want to lower costs increase the supply! Build hospitals, educate nurses and doctors, support more research, don't renew drug patents {for trivial changes}.
Unfortunately, in a few countries there are no other option. Fortunately in this country we have options. I just want us to retain that option(freedom of choice). Regarding the south central comment, it is generalized. You can't deny that it does not exist just because it's not the majority (thankfully).
sorry, the edit function isn't working for me... duke- yo homie, you don't know me. i've been out of the military for 22 years. i learned how to think for myself a long time ago. that's why i'm a democrat. there's nobody left on your side but extremists. i'm all for giving texas to you guys so the rest of us can move on from our imperialistic narcissistic past. have a nice day. ken- contrary to what some conspiracy theorists (and rude waiters) would argue, i don't think you'll ever lose your ability to choose your own care. ub:
Ken, I agree that there will always be those assholes taking advantage of the system. But it is a very small minority. Why punish the masses for the actions of a small few?
Quote from Obama today - "They do it all the time, UPS and FedEx are doing just fine. ... It's the Post Office that's always having problems."
