Trail Work Aliso Woods/Car Wreck 8/7/2010

^^^ The authorities should sign the trail as descending-only, hikers included.

On opening day for a few hours it should be climbing only so the curious can see that it's {probably} too difficult.

 

^^^ Most that knew the trail before it closed already know that it is too difficult even to hike up it. I'm a climber and I will not be able to clean it, not even close. It's a HAB due to steepness, looseness and chunkiness. I'm not saying no one CAN'T go up it at all, I'm saying it wouldn't be a good idea to.

There are lots of 2 way trails that most descend only for the most part like the Luge and Cactus. No signs needed.

 

On the subject of one-way trails, difficult trails and special purpose trails... Can someone shed some light on why there can't be a one-way trail in this case? Also, why shouldn't there be a sign stating "Steep, Rocky Trail. Use Caution!" ?? And finally, why can't we have a bikes only trail? There are plenty of Hiker only ones in the park.

 

Car Wreck and Lynx (and I think every trail in the park) are multipurpose trails. NO ONE should be riding so fast on multipurpose trails that they can't stop for hikers in either direction or bikers going up.

Hikers are looking for excuses to close the park to bikes and we should not give them ammunition. Hikers like new trails just like we do. Please give them the right of way that they are supposed to have.

 

Yeah, but they DO have more trails than we do already. What is the fundamental reasoning for Hiker only trails that would not apply to a Bikes only trail??

 

Hiker-only trails are a back-handed way of banning horses.

 

Riding in control so you can stop for hikers on multipurpose trails is a completely separate issue from whether or not there should be biker only trails.

For now I think Car Wreck is multipurpose. I think making it "bikes only" is a good idea, but I'm sure hikers would resist this for the same reasons that bikers would object to a trail being off limits for bikers.

 

Did I need a solution? Do I have a problem to solve? Is there something I was supposed to figure out?
Climb the freak'n trail if that's what you're looking to do. Makes no difference to me. I'll even give you a pat on the back now for trying, if that's what you're looking for.

 

one could make the case that some trails are better left illegal...

btw: hiker-only trails in laguna coast are primarily used to keep mountain bikers off high-use hiking trails that have steep singletrack. i guess the opposite could be true.

 

Amen!

 

I'm not saying it should be 1 way or just for bikes. Let me make it clear again. I just think some trails are left better to descend. Trails like Lynx, Luge, Cactus, Redtail/Rattlesnake, Chutes, T&A are not difficult climbs. I don't climb them because I know even though I have the right of way, there are sections on all of these trails that even going down at safe speed there is a potential for a head-ons cause of blind turns.

Just as riders have to decide when to dismount and walk a section that's too techy or steep for their level, going up something you know will have lots of downhill traffic is just asking for an accident to happen..., you have to decide if it's worth it. Ed the SR Ranger told us the day we worked it that the equestrian he spoke to told him that he would not take his horse up it because of the steepness and amount of rocky terrain. That there is an example of the judgment that needs to be better used by all users.

 

This trail is way to steep and gnarly to climb. It is nothing like Lynx or Rock-it where someone with huge lungs and good climbing skills can go up. I would have to say (if my memory serves me well) it is 95% unclimbable.

It's not so much a trail that you can give the right of way on. It is steep, rocky, and narrow. Car Wreck is more of a controled crash to the bottom. Heck, it is probably safer to ride it faster due to if you where to ride it slow you would be probably skidding and wrecking all the way down.

I think that if they made some of the trails in Aliso Woods directional and used some kind of rating system to let people know what they're getting theirselves into, that would help out with user relations immenesly.

 

I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here but... IMHO, Car Wreck will require a certain amount of downhill speed to keep one from sticking a tire in the rocks and going OTB... and that amount of speed will make it all but impossible for any rider to avoid a clueless hiker or uphill biker (especially one with earbuds plugged in). Seems to me that is simply a safety issue and were I riding down I would ad least like some amount of protection when the inevitable lawyer gets involved and tries to pin the responsibility on the MTBer. I'm voting for this to become a one way downhill trail at a very minimum and a bikes only one way trail as the maximum. also appropriate signage about the difficulty would be a good idea.

 

I'm not trying to beat a deadhorse either but for now Car Wreck is a 2 way multipurpose trail. That means no one should be bombing down it at speed. If you take out a hiker it probably will be your fault.

 

Have you rode the trail or are you stating trail etiquette?

Dean

 

You have a valid point. I have never ridden it and never will.

 

This is just my point. It may be now but it really makes little sense once you see it. Have you EVEN looked at the trail? I see from your response to Dean that you have not ridden it, but have you even walked it??
As for hikers on that trail, like the man said You can't cure stupid.

 

We're going in circles. It does sound like it should be 1 way and should be bikers only. The fact is that for now it is a multipurpose trail and will have hikers on it. Therefore you DH folks need to be able to stop if you encounter a hiker.

And why do you assume hikers on that trail are stupid? Hikers like a challenge just like bikers do. They probably think you are stupid for trying to bike on it. We need to respect each other.

(I'm done beating the poor horse.)

 

The issue has nothing to do with respect, simply safety. I fail to understand why it seems impossible to have a REAL discussion about REAL issues here. I stand by my original statement... hiking on that trail is simply unsafe given its characteristics. To insist that somehow because it is deemed "multi-use" makes it not so is illogical.

 

Awesome work everyone!! Your trail work will be rewarded for the next 10yrs.

Making car wreck a double black diamond? You've got to be kidding. You people need to get out of the parks and ride some
serious trails. It's a good steep trail, but there is nothing on it that a hardtail can't clear.

Rock-it is a much more dangerous trail due to the speed you carry, lets make that an uphill only trail instead.