The Good, the Bad, the Luge (Updated 01-03-15)

I appreciate trailwork too. I helped Kioti build some crucial berms on The Luge last year and worked the drainage to make it sustainable. Cut back some vegetation to make it easier to see and thus safer. I appreciate anybody's labor, but when I suddenly see a man-made staircase appear, that's a pretty serious alteration (and a helluva lot of work). Could be lots of fun, but freelancing could get carried away. I think an organized, sanctioned approach will yield more favorable, sustainable results.

 

It was a lot of work, but i will remove it, i realize now that i should not of altered the trail that majorly. I will fix it and make it the way it was before in that section, from now on i will only do maintenance. Sorry guys, got carried away i guess..

 

Right on! Here we go again with all this regulation bs. I'm probably going to get negative proped for this...lol haha this ain't pink bike! Shouldn't we all leave the regulation to the regulators? I mean it's great that some of us have a hall pass to spruce things up but I think we are overstepping our authority when we are preaching regulations with no authority. I doubt that folks in other areas of the country are working to get a legal hall pass just to work on a trail.

Dude just leave it! You committed already...just sit back and enjoy the fruits of your creation.

 

As per Debra Clarke who is the Wilderness/Trails Manager & District Volunteer Coordinator, Jim aka kioti has the authority to schedule work on STT/Luge. Jim has earned it due to the amount of hours spent while rehabbing the area after the Santiago Fire.

Yes we do trail work, but mostly do our work in the Santa Ana's. Trails like Upper and Lower Holy Jim, Trabuco, West Horse Thief, Silverado Motorway, Joplin, Los Pinos, Bell Ridge, Coldwater, Yeagar Mesa, Smashface, Old and New San Juan upper loop above Cocktail Rocks all the way to Blue Jay. We've cleared fallen trees on Maple Springs, Main Divide and yes, we have done work on STT & Luge. In fact, me and 1 other WS member cleared brush on sections of STT and the Luge when it was really overgrown.

















Ned and I are WS Trail Directors and are both "Official" Forest Service volunteers which means we call into dispatch when we start and when we finish, then submit a trail report when complete. You do need to be a registered volunteer to do trail work "officially", but I also know there are many who are not. Nothing wrong with clearing a branch or 2 with your folding saw while your on your ride or lopping here and there, but how many of you carry these things? I actually have a compact lopper and folding saw provided to me by the WS.(just means I didn't pay for it, but mine to keep)

Along with Jim(kioti), we also helped rehab STT and Luge after the fires as we were part of a group of people who could legally enter these areas when they were closed. We were asked to do patrols and assessments to the burned areas and took part of the "Official" reopening of STT/Luge: STT-Luge National Forest Re opening Ride


Parks like Whiting Ranch, Aliso, Santiago Oaks, O'Neil Park, etc, you also need to be registered with the county. I am also a volunteer for OC Parks and Ca State Parks as many of the WS member and yes, we have been properly trained and is why we usually can lead a group of volunteers to do trail work just as Jim(kioti) does. WS members have also done plenty of work in the parks, but we do it as SHARE or IMBA members as many of us are also part or those groups

As far as being "Official", the difference is in the Santa Ana's when the gates are closed along the Main Divide, we have access and can open the gates which allows us to drive up with our tools, but we're still required to notify the FS that we are going in and call in and out of service when we do trail work, patrols or assessments. We can run power tools and chain saws. You have to be certified to operate a chain saw in the National Forest. We are also assigned a call sign so dispatch knows who we are and who to contact in case of emergency.

Being an "Official" OC Parks or Chrystal Cove(El Moro) volunteer, I have access to the all the tool boxes you see at Aliso and also those in Whiting. I am able to go into the parks and do trail work as needed, then report to the ranger as to what I've done and also submit my volunteer hours to the County and State Park volunteer coordinators. At the State Park level, we are also covered by their insurance while doing our volunteering if we were to get injured, but only during our scheduled time so it's important to get approved on the date you requested for your volunteer time.

Sorry for the winded reply, but thought I needed to clear some thing up. The WS has a policy that we no longer post on STR or any other message boards when we do our trail work. Many who ride the trails I mentioned know we when we've cleared or do tread work on those trails.

 

Personally, I am not asking for you to remove the stairs. Looks like you did a ton of work. I haven't ridden it, so I have no opinion of how it rides (or how it drains). I am just suggesting you pull back the throttle on significant alterations. I think if you/we stick to berm reinforcement, brake bump removal (only when saturated!), vegetation maintenance, drainage issues, refilling of dangerous ruts, reinforcing of parts of the trail that may have slid off the edge and that kind of thing, we will have plenty to do and the trails will maintain their natural challenges.

I learned a lot about proper drainage placement above a bermed turn and frankly, I don't think I'm very good at it without Kioti confirming where to cut and dig. Whoever did the recent drainage work on Cactus in Whiting appears to have done it right (Kevinator, I believe) so that it doesn't disrupt the turn. I guess we shall see when this rain hits.

Some folks would advocate for removing rocks and making drop-offs more friendly (I've heard the terms "sanitizing" or "dumbing down") - I hope no one does that!

 

I dont like the water run off on Cactus, disrupts my flow = ) but the trails are for everyone. But it is a great idea and excellent work- thanks.

WS has a great influence two the two wheel community, they do more then you can think... However, we know you meant no harm when you were up there cleaning and such. Thanks for the effort.

 

I have worked with Gene / WS / Jim, Calvin etc they know more about trails maintenance than I ever will I am just labor .. so I would look to them for guidance especially for such a "Core" trail as the Luge.

FD appreciate your effort, I think you are the guy that fixed the bad rut on the Corkscrew...thanks.

I to help the STT Rehab after the fires loved good work ... there are particular sections I think of as My Babies ..

Ya know Gene doesn't invite me very often any more....maybe it was that running with the power hedger incident :?:

 

I haven't ridden it yet and hope you leave it. I also hope you continue your hard work. Thanks!

 

I am overdue for some trail work.
If one of you authorized types has a plan for the weekend, please shoot me your contract info.

 

I would like to ride those steps too - can you wait a week Pezman??

 

Please leave the stair steps for now. The feature can always be removed later if it proves to be too unpopular. Thanks for the effort.

 

FDPEZ those steps look pretty legit and you left open a flow line...loks like legit trail work to me. Dont let the STR wimps bring yah down buddy if you build they will come. heard the jump you put in was pretty sweet and that comes from a friend who built one of the best flow trails at oakley. If you pass his test you pass many others..thanks for the work!

 

Thanks everyone. I rode the Luge Sunday afternoon and it was fine. Didn't need anything other than some brake bump removal and all the drains cleared. It's in a status of being considered as an official Forest Service trail, which would protect it, so I'm leery of adding mountain bike specific features. I appreciate Jeff's work, but would advise keeping man-made features to a minimum as there has been no talk of making this a mountain-bike specific trail. Not that I'm opposed to that, but my primary concern is that it remain open to all users and as an experiment in trough-shaped trails and their sustainability, counter to traditional trail work standards.

I'm busy this weekend or I'd put together a work day, although it would more likely be in Aliso and Wood Canyon, where Mentally Sensitive, Car Wreck and other trails are more in need of work. A friend and I walked MS and Meadows with the Ranger during the week and discussed options for both trails, as well as the controversy over the non-official trail closure policy and recent activities.

Thank you all for your patience and understanding,
Jim aka kioti

 

I just did a walk on the Luge to check conditions, there are multiple small land slides and large rocks everywhere. I did not have time to clear, looks like a days worth of work. It is not rideable at this time.

 

At 8:00am, it's pouring up here by Cook's. Two strong cells just passed through. If the Luge had problems yesterday, they're going to be much worse today. Mudslides certainly possible and I'd expect the slopes to be unstable for days if not longer as the water percolates through the soil. Consider parts of the Luge similar to avalanche zones in the high mountains, with mud and rock slides instead of snow. You can not ride the Luge without crossing beneath potential slide paths, or having the trail potentially disappear beneath you as the topsoil slides off bedrock.

 

Cleaned the luge from the bottom to about have way with Boaz. Did some burm repair, added a burm or two and built up the pre existing ones. The rest of the luge needs to be cleared of rocks and debris and some semi deep ruts. Did some repair on the jumps and blocked them off with some rocks because they are very soft. the whole trail is very soft and should not be ridden for at least a day after the rain stops. so one full day of no rain for it to dry to the point of being rideable. As of right now it is still not in ridable shape.

 

Thanks Boaz!

 

What the? There's a new foreign structure at the Luge. Oakley Sender anyone?

 

any idea if the rocks/slides are cleared on luge? or anyone out there ridden it yet today? looking to get some info on the current condition of luge