Ok guys, Ive been Parusing the SRC #3 thread.... And I have some thoughts to share about racing in general, but Sandbagging or not sandbagging will be a big part. First off, ANY CLASS OR DISCIPLINE BETWEEN OLD FAT GUYS, AND EXPERT CLASS... will ALL have Sandbaggers in them. Very, Very few places will regulate someone moving up a class. So get used to it. Now let me clarify a few things as well. A fast time does not make you a sandbagger. If you have never raced before, Race beginner...Get a feel for how its done, what the program is.... thats what the beginner class is for. Now, this is something EVERYONE should be taking into account. If your in beginner or sport, you WILL end up against guys that have no idea how fast they are, plan on it in every race. It happens, get over it. There isnt a qualifying run at most places to decide for you what class you should be in. This happens in Beginner, sport, and sometimes in expert. Now lets talk about when you ARE sandbagging. If you are racing beginner, and you are always top three....Your sandbagging....If your racing beginner, and you would be placing the same or higher in the next class up......your sandbagging........If you have been racing beginner for more than two years.....Guess what..... you need to move up. Moving up a class isnt always about where you are placing. This is specially prevelant for the beginner class. Beginner class is about finding how fast you are, and learning about racing. Sport class.... well you go there when you knwo the game, even if you were not placing the best in Beginner, your place may very well may need to be in a higher class. Expert class isnt for everyone, but its for alot of people out there. Moving up is part of wat pushes us to go faster, and get better. Sand bagging Happens, All age groups, most classes, all disciplines, and in most sports. Dont let it ruin your going out and having a good time. Unfortunatly, there are those in the race scene that "need" a trophy to have fun. I for one, and not one of those, while its fun, its not what makes my weekend.
Just had a discussion about this with my buddy. I say beginner is for people who have been riding a year or less. If you have been riding for a while and have experience you are not a beginner. You might be slow, but you are not a beginner. Don't race slower people to feel fast. It is called racing so you should be training for it to get faster to beat other people. Don't not train to not get fast, but race against slower people to do good. If you don't want to train and push yourself to be faster, why race?
i beg to differ. what happens if Joe is always mid pack beginner? after 2 years he should move into sport where he will more than likely finish last? i think you are sandbagging when you are significantly ahead of people in times. for example, the first race, i got third, and evvery single person was seperated by about a second. this past race, i won by 1.2 seconds, and 3rd place was 6 seconds behind. i dont think i was sandbagging, i just happend to get someone in front of me that dropped his chain, and as soon as i saw him, it made me pedal harder. honestly, had that guy not dropped his chain in front of me, i would have not gotten first. now, if i move up, i would barely be getting top 10 finishes in sport, and tahts assuming i have a completely clean race run and pedal my balls off. if i stay in beginner chances are i will win another race, but i'm sure i will also barely make podiums in some races. also, just because i win one race by a large margin, does not make me a sandbagger. Eric carter has won both round 1 and 2 by at leaast 8-10 seconds, and is he a sandbagger? :-k maybe he should move into his own class, so its fair, and he wont be sandbagging anymore. *if you are reading this Mr. Carter, no disrespect, but i'm jealous of your ability to constantly own the other pro's. * oh and also, if i moves up to expert i would have finished about 25th out of 34, and the last 8 or so guys all crashed prerttty badly :lol:
Aww but I really like those trophies... JK I raced the southridge series for a couple years and I saw myself move from beginner to sport over the course of a year. I was placing top 3 in beginner but it was mostly because my field at the time [17-18] didnt have that many racers. I decided to upgrade to sport and also I moved to the 19-26 age group. It meant less medals for me but I didnt care. I like to be out there to race and have fun. If I win a medal good for me, its almost time to move up another class.
I was Mid pack in beginner all year last year.... Now I am mid pack in sport. I may make a second year in sport depending on if I stay mid pack, but my goal is for expert by next year. If you are always on the Podium<which means top five in most cases> Its time to step up, get faster, and move up.
... Hmm...I don't think racing is for me. Seems like a lot of stress. I just want to ride some trails. I do like going fast ... even though Im' the slowest!
I have only been mountain biking for 9 months and decided to enter my first race. I entered the Southridge 2009 winter series xc beg 35-42 and placed 1st in race #1 and #2. The gap between 1st and 2nd place was 5 min first race and 8 min the 2nd race. I don't want to loose my points moving to the sport class now and I plan on moving to sport class next series. Am I a sand bagger at this point being still very new to racing and mountain biking?
You bring up a good point. Racing is not for everybody. But you never know until you try it. I got my feet wet with one race and was surprised how fun it was. So then I did the other two races in the series thinking that I would step back and evaluate if I wanted to race or not. I swear I keep saying "After this series, I'll kick back for a bit." I haven't done so yet. I'm up to five races under my belt--and I don't feel like I'm really even racing. I just kinda ride as fast as I can (almost oblivious to the other racers) and then they tell me how I did afterwards. The point is, I didn't think racing would be for me, but it seems it is. For the moment. If it ever becomes such work that riding isn't fun, I'm out! One of the perks is that you start to get to know some really good (and fast) riders. Oh, we were talking about sandbagging: It's lame. Don't do it.
It's all relevant. If you are racing Southridge or Rim Nordic or another race that may have a less number of competitive racers as your first racing experience, and there are another two guys in your class and each of them is 40 lbs overweight and barely making it to the end of the course and you end up smoking them, it doesn't make you qualified for moving up to Sport. And doing the same thing on the same course a couple of times again doesn't mean you should move up. Go to the beginner class at the Sea Otter and race against 80-90 folks and you'll end up getting smoked. Race the entire SO Cal State Series or the Kenda US Cup West and the So Cal State Championship and then at the end of the season figure out where you really are. Winning in an uncompetitive category doesn't qualify you for moving up. It also definitely does not make you a sandbagger. As DirtymikeTDB suggests, beginner class is a venue for learning to race. Only consider moving up once you're confident that you have become an experienced racer because the folks in Sport are very competitive. The rule is simple: RACE IN THE CATEGORY IN WHICH YOU WILL HAVE THE MOST FUN AND IN WHICH YOU CAN FINISH IN THE SAFEST WAY TO YOURSELF AND OTHERS. Set your goals and enter the category that best allows you to get to them...
If your very first race is the very first race of the year at Southridge, you're probably not going to get a good idea as to where you stand normally. The first race, at least in XC, brings out a bunch of people who do their first race in the beginner class. This meant a bunch of hardcore roadies, or guys that have been riding for years, all show up in the beginner class that first race of the season, but you can't blame them if they don't know any better. I didn't notice that this year in sport though.
No, not at all, Your going on your third race now, your still getting a feel for the racing event and how things go. Finish the series out, if you stay on top the whole time, move up for the next series. Now if you stay five minutes Plus ahead and stay in teh beginner class after the series is over..... Well that might be different. Bwahahahahaha
In the short period of time I have been racing I have noticed that there is a trickle down effect for sandbagging. It seems with the removal of Simi Pro its made it worse. So the Semi Pros had to make a choice move up to Pro where you are racing guys with much more support, or drop down to Expert where you may be much faster. So knowing that people in sport that may have moved up are going to stay knowing Expert just got faster, then same for beginner. There also seems to be a number of people who feel that winning is more important then getting better. I can somewhat understand with sites like sponsor house etc.. where what looks better a 2nd in sport or 9th in expert to a company. Plus its fun it call your friends sandbaggers.
This is my 2nd year racing the XC beg. class and I'm still finishing last!#-o Is there a class below beginner, so I can do some sandbagging! Maybe the kids race!:-k I'd still get beat!](*,)
