Let's talk about P-Lines

[MohammedInABearSuit]

So, In my 3 parks ride I've been riding some of the local county trails and am noticing a significant degradation of much of the single-track due to folks riding the pussy line.

Specifically:
Stairsteps
Rock-It
Fenceline

So, here is what I'd like to ask:

1) Do you ride this line?
2) Why/Why not?

Now, since I ride my 'Cross bike in most of these areas I can appreciate the sometimes need for "alternate" routes but my opinion is that if you feel the need to ride the p-line (not just use it for a quick bail out) then perhaps you should get off the bike and walk rather than participate in widening of the single-track.

I also see a whole bunch of washboarding (even on the p-line) which is typically caused by riders skidding downhill so maybe one should not be riding faster than one's skill allow?:?:

Opinions???

 

[dirtyjeff]

I agree with you, the trails are getting wider by the week, sad, but true. If possible, please avoid the edges of the trail.
As for the washboards, people please stop skidding! I have noticed just about all the local trails getting really bad, if you are constantly skidding, you are out of control, slow down!
Thanks for bringing this up! :beer:

 

[Kish Me]

P-lines are like turnouts on a mountain road... It clears the path for the more skilled riders.

Most people that ride the P-line probably don't relize that it wasn't always there.

STAIRSTEPS has a P-LINE ???

 

[mfoga]

I think is socal there is a number of issues that will help cause this. To many riders with a way to large of range of skill set. Second is that some of these trails dont have any warning that they are harder then others. I mean trails should have ratings. We all know that will never happen in these public parks though. Some of this could be directly due to the fact that some of these trails can be high speed trails downhill but are two way trails so they are trying to get out of the way of hikers/bikers climbing.

 

[art23rockpile]

STAIRSTEPS has a P-LINE ???

StairSteps and RockIt ARE P-lines! :lol:

 

[MohammedInABearSuit]

...STAIRSTEPS has a P-LINE ???

There is one developing on the left hand side wherever things get "tough"


Actually, I would recommend that folks who have a tough time there ride the single track that starts 10 feet to the left of the Trail sign.
Dunno if it is legal, but appears so.
This bypasses the toughest part of the trail IMHO.

Now, if we could just get a decent connector from El Moro/LCW so I don't have tp push the damn bike UP this trail

 

[NitrOx]

StairSteps and RockIt ARE P-lines! :lol:

True. There are better, steeper, gnarlier single tacks in the park.

 

[Edog]

I think that on 2 of the mentioned trails uphill traffic is contributing to this maybe as much. Seems the uphill RockIt route is becoming ever more popular.
I was flying down the center of rocky area in rockit a couple of weeks ago, and some dude nearly passed me screaming down the p line, infact I have no doubt that that is what he was trying to do.:?:
Interesting to note that in bike magizine this month they reviewed the Pivot 429 and raved how capable it was in the rough. Then took pictures on stair steps riding the P line:?:

 

[sasquatch9billion]

I've noticed there have been a lot of very inexperienced young riders showing up on the trails these days. I like to blame them.:lol:

 

[dstepper]

I think it proofs the need for more trails Orange Couty trails take a beating for use. More trails would speed the ware around. I normally stay away for the trails mentioned on the weekends.

Dean

 

[MohammedInABearSuit]

True. There are better, steeper, gnarlier single tacks in the park.

yes. but then that would be poaching

 

[Bryguy17]

sometimes it's a matter of flow though. while I have no problem to charging a trail of dubious safety, I do like to do so smoothly. that involves using the entire trail, p-line or not. I don't cut new p-lines unless I'm bailing, but I probably do make use of some in the interest of riding smoothly. it's not necessarily a matter of me not being able to deal with the trail section being avoided, but rather being able to maintain momentum, speed, and control.

honestly, I don't ride the ones on rock-it, can't think of the ones on fenceline or stairsteps. their formation is probably as was stated: a too-large user group with too wide of a skill range on trails that many can't safely handle.

 

[Winger]

I completely agree with this topic, and it frustrates me. Many trails seem overused. In the 6 years I've been biking, I've noticed most of the trails getting wider.

Fenceline used to be my favorite trail in El Morro...as wide as my handlebars. This weekend we rode and it was wide enough for 2 bikes. I commented after Rattlesnake that it was incredibly easy...practically a beginner singletrack.

Chutes in Santiago Oaks has P-lines all over that zig zag across the fun luge-type section at the end. They even appeared in the technical section, despite there being a specific bypass trail cut.

Peter's Canyon used to have a tight singletrack through the Eucalyptus trees, which is now a freeway.

 

[NitrOx]

yes. but then that would be poaching

Also True. Though I must say that the p-line on rock-it is safer for climbing due to DH traffic. The faster folks usually stay on the rocks and just fly down. I just don't want a head on collision as I know they won't be able to stop quickly.

The p-line you mention on Steps is not really a p-line as it is not part of the trail. It is more like another trail (single track for that matter) that connects to steps.

 

[sasquatch9billion]

Chutes in Santiago Oaks has P-lines all over that zig zag across the fun luge-type section at the end. They even appeared in the technical section, despite there being a specific bypass trail cut.

Peter's Canyon used to have a tight singletrack through the Eucalyptus trees, which is now a freeway.

Perfect examples. I always get caught off guard by the p-lines on chutes and end up riding them and cursing myself for not paying attention.

 

[Nagaredama]

Anyway of blocking the P-Line with brush or rocks?

 

[mr.hobbs]

Also True. Though I must say that the p-line on rock-it is safer for climbing due to DH traffic. The faster folks usually stay on the rocks and just fly down. I just don't want a head on collision as I know they won't be able to stop quickly.

The p-line you mention on Steps is not really a p-line as it is not part of the trail. It is more like another trail (single track for that matter) that connects to steps.

It's the orig. trail that has seen some new life. On a rigid it's more fun for sure.

 

[NitrOx]

It's the orig. trail that has seen some new life. On a rigid it's more fun for sure.

Oh I see. So the p-line is the waterfall section? Excellent, I do like the p-line better!!!

 

[wizard]

I've noticed there have been a lot of very inexperienced young riders showing up on the trails these days. I like to blame them.:lol:

You buy a bike at the LBS and they give you a good shove out the door. It's kinda like if everyone walked into car dealers with no license or driving experience, buy cars, and hit the freeways. I am not advocating licensing MTB'rs, but why do we have to learn proper riding protocol by trial and error?:?: Maybe bike advocacy groups should work closer with the LBS's to point new riders in the right direction. At least give them a handout or something.

 

[1TrackMind]

There is one developing on the left hand side wherever things get "tough"


Now, if we could just get a decent connector from El Moro/LCW so I don't have tp push the damn bike UP this trail

Part of the problem on Stairsteps in particular is that the p-line is the easiest way to HAB up it...this may be contributing to the widening as well.