How to fire a customer in 10 minutes or less

Discussion in 'Bike Shop Reviews' started by mtnbikerfred, May 14, 2008.

  1. bvader

    bvader Long Live The Gorn!

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    I have had a number of fittings (and IMHO they are well worth it) and they have always been scheduled on off hours and most importantly can not and should not be rushed. That is just "The way of the fit".

    I have even gone so far as to do a healthy ride before hand so I am a bit tired and tender so that I can really help in the feedback of what feels right etc.

    You may have been a bit frustrated but if you are going to get a fit, you want to take full advantage of it.
     
  2. UR2KLOS

    UR2KLOS Senior Member

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    It was not the Path. I appreciate the explanation. Makes sense and it would have been nice if my sales guy gave me this explanation and told me I couldn't do it on saturdays before hand.
     
  3. Rondo

    Rondo Member

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    Must be Bike Bling...
     
  4. Mongo

    Mongo Chewyeti "MongOHNO!"

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    Want my money and devotion? The shop needs to fit MY schedule. If I have to inconvenience MY schedule, to give you MY money, then I will just take my business else where. I will work with a shop with in limits. But I will not put myself out to spend my money.

    Noe, with that said. If the shop is doing ME a favor, then I will bend to the shops will.
     
  5. Pain Freak

    Pain Freak Dead or Alive

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    That's why they need to set up appointments.
     
  6. verumlike

    verumlike Mr. XSV

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    I'm new to the mtb world, and as with alot of people interested in the sport we are spoke down to in shops as if they are superior.... I've seen plenty of people, including myself buy second hand because I don't feel like being spoken to as if i'm retarded.... If I am asking s stupid question... Answer it... Don't laugh,
    I didn't know the answer was obvious... God I could go on with a huge list of ugly comments bike shops have used with me...
     
  7. Mongo

    Mongo Chewyeti "MongOHNO!"

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    Sorry to hear it, but it happens. I haven't bought anything from la habra or fullerton yet but have made numerous phone call's getting info on purchases and have had great service from both. I went to the path because they had what i was looking for and had great service from there as well. I have also had a bad experience with a good lbs. Everyone has their bad day's and I will normally give a second chance. Even I'm an A hole some times. (I know, it's hard to believe):-k:lol:
     
  8. guero

    guero iFroth

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    sounds like someone should call...

    [​IMG]
     
  9. verumlike

    verumlike Mr. XSV

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    I'm new to the mtb world, and as with alot of people interested in the sport we are spoke down to in shops as if they are superior.... I've seen plenty of people, including myself buy second hand because I don't feel like being spoken to as if i'm retarded.... If I am asking s stupid question... Answer it... Don't laugh,
    I didn't know the answer was obvious... God I could go on with a huge list of uly comments bike shops have used with me...
     
  10. danmtchl

    danmtchl danmtchl

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    When I started working in a shop about 7 years ago, my boss let me give my buddies stuff 10% ABOVE cost and one of my riding buddies wanted a set of Crossmax Xl's, so I ordered them up and they came and he still wanted a better discount. If I remember correctly they were around $400-450 cost and he was getting for 10% more which is still 30% less than retail. Well he said they were still to much and I had to end up buying the wheels so I wouldn't get in trouble. Needless to say that was the last time we offered that deal to anyone.

    I also hated when punk little kids would bring in the Dan's Comp catalog and tell me they could get things cheaper. I would ask them why are you hear bothering me then.

    Some people don't understand that there is not much markup in most things. Tubes and cheapie tires have the most markup, but most things are 30-40% markup. So when you ask for a bottle, cage, seatbag, tubes, pumps and everything else so you can get a deal, the shop is losing money on the sale. I had one guy even ask for clipless pedals and shoes thrown in on a Giant Yukon which retailed around $470 the pedal and shoes were half of that. I hate to say it but I laughed at him because it was a ridiclous request and when the other local shops laughed him out the door also he came back and purchased the bike, shoes and we gave him a good deal on some pedals.

    I could go on for days with these types of stories
     
  11. slacker

    slacker Rides Again!!!

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    I am going to admit right now that I am no genius nor ever make claims to be but simple math and common sense are things I can confidently say I am capable of using. I worked in the bicycle industry for 10+ years, wearing many hats and have been fortunate enough to work in some very nice places and also in some not so great. With that said please understand my perspective as a customer comes with some knowledge. Limited? Yes, but I think this is relatively simple matter and it should suffice.

    I brought my bike (left it on the car outside) to a certain shop everyone seems to love to get some small parts, the main piece was a 140mm brake rotor as I was upgrading the brakes to new XTR on my Cannondale Scalpel. When I asked for this part they gladly gave it to me and we headed for the register. I was then posed the question, as to what bike and what parts I was using this for. I then briefly told them what I had and that I had already tried to mount the caliper with a 160mm rotor and it appeared to be aproximately 2cm off. I was told with confidence by the sales person who then asked a nearby mechanic, he agreed with the sales person who said I was incorrect and that I need order a 20mm frame IS Frame adaptor which was not in stock otherwise it would not fit. I then politely disagreed, wheeled the carcass of my bike in and showed them in person, still they disagreed. At which point I just asked to purchase the rotor and made no fuss what so ever, bought my part and went home. I mounted up the rotor, dropped the caliper on, centered it and was off to El Moro, it's still working fine to this day.

    What bothered me first and foremost was that 2 people could not figure out the simple math of it. One being someone who probably has touched at least a bike or two of an owner on these forums and is somewhat responsibly for their safety in that respect. Secondly that I was told that I was wrong, not something more personable like "that doesn’t sound right, let me check" or "if it appears it wont fit, don’t force it, just bring it back (and inform me of potential restocking costs if applicable)" and then let me figure it out.

    It just appears to me that these days in Southern California that the bicycle industry is becoming more wal-martish with the multi-store chains and concept stores popping up. The sad part is that it seems more so to be coming from the inside out thru low wages, hiring of inexperienced staff without proper training (especially in service departments), and no requirements of any education thru Barnett or comparable experience. These practices are not exclusive to the larger stores but are sort of trickle down effect as the owners of smaller stores are forced to compete to stay alive, in some cases having to put customers like myself in the position I was in.

    Many of these scenarios are the fruit of us the customer though, every single one of us who bases their shopping practices based solely on price are causing this epidemic and those who haggle in the shop are even worse. It's common knowledge that West Coast shops operate on a thinner margin then East Coast shops and many of those East Coast shops pay better (20-30% in my experience) so they can attract better, more knowledgeable, more intelligent, and capable staff with less employee turnover.

    I am trying not to have this be about pointing fingers so take from this what you will but please try to use it constructively. Consumers, please be reasonable with your expectations of price and your deserving of a deal especially with Labor costs. Shops, please train the people you have to be able to properly perform the functions you are paying them for and as they become more capable, compensate them as such. At the same time be reasonable with price, stay close to MSRP and be an example of how to properly do business.

    Thanks for reading especially if you've made it this far.
     
  12. Pho'dUp

    Pho'dUp Spam Musubi MasherSS

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    Slacker I think you should just name the shop. I'm sure the shop owner and it's employees would like to know that they were wrong. Not everyone is perfect 100% of the time but learning is a step in the right direction.
     
  13. slacker

    slacker Rides Again!!!

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    You're right in both respects.

    Not everyone is 100% perfect all the time but maybe one of the two people could have got it right.

    I am sure they would want to know. So I am going to send them a message and let them handle it internally, quitely. Their response will then influence my next course of action in that regard.
     
  14. TMS

    TMS New Member

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    I sort of thought he did.:?:
     
  15. new2mtb

    new2mtb I'm a newbie!

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    Same thing happened to me, got a new bike at a good price, took it home then found out, bolts on my front calipers were all loose. Tightened and checked everything else, then rode it. After i got home i noticed my rear brake was rubbing, then found out i got a stuck piston. Took it back to the shop since I didn't want to buy a bleed kit for something that was suppose to work. I explained first to the cashier, then to a tech, then another one and they all thought its "normal". They re-adjusted and said the other piston "has" to move sooner or later :D, i just quietly left, rode it , rubbed again, took it back again. Again explained that it was a stuck piston, either get it rebuilt or warrantied. One of the older guys heard my explanation and knew exactly what I meant. The next day they replaced the calipers :) then when I got home i noticed the hose were leaking.. *sigh*. I just went ahead and bought a bleed kit, not worth the stress of explaining again..

    I'll still buy from the store. They always give me good price on bikes, but the techs, its a hit or miss.. and I don't want to risk my bike :D


     
  16. danmtchl

    danmtchl danmtchl

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    If you have to argue with the employees, it is not a shop worth going to. Many times we would just pull the part off another bike on the floor and warranty the part and when the new part came in we would put the bike back on the floor. Word of mouth is the best type of advertising and if you do not have a good experience with certain shops, that can hurt your business seriously.

    A few weeks ago I was riding and the brake line just came out while I tapped the brakes while riding. I did not have a bleed kit and took it to the shop where I used to work and the mechanic had a pissy attitude and took 4 days to bleed my brakes. When I picked up my bike I test rode it in the parking lot, the brakes would stop at all and I needed reblead now because I was leaving town that day to go riding in Santa Cruz. Again he got pissy said it would take another couple of days. Well I took the bike with me and told the owner I will not be back in EVER. I was a loyal customer and employee for 15 years.

    On the way out of town I get a phone call from the owner and he told me he fired that employee and will fix it when I return to town. When I returned the owner apologized and we (him and I) reblead the system and there was a ton of air in the lines. I thanked him for rectifying the problem.

    When I worked at this shop we got comments all the time on how good our customer service was. Most of the time we got repairs done in one day and the shop across the street offered lifetime service, but came across the street to us and PAID us to do a tuneup or whatever because we could get it done faster and better than the shop across the street. Customers do not want their bikes sitting in a shop for a week to do a tune up, I know I don't. Customer service is key in a small business and if you don't have excellent service you will find that business closing soon.
     
  17. 2wheel_lee

    2wheel_lee Active Member

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    Hmm...doing some simple math...
    Let's see...you say the caliper appeared 2 cm (20 mm) off with a 160 mm rotor (i.e., 20 mm radius difference). That would mean the radius being 20 mm off would mean that presumably the caliper mount was for a disc that was 40 mm larger or smaller (I didn't quite catch which way you meant). Either someone is not good at simple math or they are over exaggerating the situation. ;)
     
  18. spookydave

    spookydave A little dab will do me

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    I've enjoyed this thread. lol

    As a biz owner that's open to both retail and wholesale I do agree with one thing.

    Some customers do need to be fired in 10 min or less.
     
  19. slacker

    slacker Rides Again!!!

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    The math part was that you could either raise the caliper up 2cm and then use a 160mm rotor or mount the caliper strtaight to the frame and use a 140mm rotor, I was told the later was not possible by the folks at the shop. This should have been easily visible as I brought in the bike with a 160mm rotor on the rear and the caliper was bottoming out on the rotor by aproximately 2cm(distance from mounting holes on caliper to frame, visible from the side of the bike). Had I mounted the caliper first and then tried to insert the wheel on the rear of the frame, it would not fit in place as the rotor would hit the body of the caliper. Imagine trying to putting a 700c wheel on to a 20" bmx frame, it looked somwhat similar in the respect that the round object would not fit into it's proper place/path of rotation.

    I apologize if the math confuses some people but if you read in further you will see my logic of using a smaller rotor rather then extend the caliper from the frame(to not bottom out) with an extra peice was simpler yet correct.
     
  20. 2wheel_lee

    2wheel_lee Active Member

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    Yes, bad math is confusing. :lol:

    Back to the math (geometry)...if mounting the caliper directly to the frame allows you to use a 140 mm rotor, spacing the caliper 20 mm would require that you use a 180 mm rotor, not a 160 mm rotor. You'd need to space the caliper 10 mm to use a 160 mm rotor. Remember, the amount you space the caliper is the difference in radius, not the difference in rotor diameter.

     

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