Laguna Canyon Foundation Meeting last night 8-13-15

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by dstepper, Aug 14, 2015.

  1. dstepper

    dstepper (R.I.P.) Over the hill

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    I attended the meeting in Laguna Beach last night and found it very encouraging. Hallie Jones director of LCF was there as was Stacy Blackwood director of Orange County parks. They both seem to be on the same page in reaching out to the MTBing community. I stopped going to these meetings years ago because they never went anywhere and became a venue for the hiking crowd to beat on the mountain bikers. The meeting was focus on trial issues and they introduced the two new LCF trail crew members that are doing trail building and maintenance. MTBers outnumbered the hikers significantly and many hikers left early after hearing LCF was interested in promoting MTB. This new younger land mangers seem to get it. In short maybe in is time to give the land magagers another chance. They acknowledge that when they close an outlaw trail in Laguna we just build another one and the decades old game never changes. Yes they are open to make some fall line trails legal. We are talking about the 40,000 acres that are El Moro, Woods Aliso Canyon and Laguna Wilderness Parks. Irvine open space is under other management.

    We did talk about yesterdays sale of driftwood estates to the Orange County Transit Authority and the possible no trespassing ordinance that may be coming. The property closed escrow yesterday so it is a done deal. Hallie is talking to OCTA and there is a possibility of closing some trails like Hawk Drop and keeping the ridge line trail open for use. Lets hope we do better in Laguna than Ladera Ranch and Rose Canyon faired against OCTA.

    In short contact them, be trained in trail maintenance, adopt a trail program is coming, bells in a box for downhill runs coming, hopefully new maps with suggested loops for people not familiar with the parks coming.

    Dean
     
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  2. FD Pezman

    FD Pezman Member

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    Nice Dean, wish I had been there. That's one of the better things I have heard in a while! I'm glade that they are now taking into account of their biggest user, the MTB'r. I might have to talk to some one about adopting a trail...
     
  3. jeepr84

    jeepr84 Member

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    Thanks Dean...I wish this site had the traffic that it used to so more people could get this kind of info. Is there a website you can post that has a schedule of future meetings?
     
  4. dstepper

    dstepper (R.I.P.) Over the hill

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    http://lagunacanyon.org/ signup to volunteer get on their email list. They did not announce any more meetings just asked to contact them if you wanted to help. I will donate bells better yet I will give out bar bells if they let me put my company name and number on them. I will pay to print maps if they also let me advertise on them as would many other companies. The current map they give away out sucks...one map for each park and no continuous map for all the parks. They are against putting lots of signs out there and I like that. Troy Lee's company has been designing and putting some signs out there.

    Dean
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 15, 2015
  5. mike001

    mike001 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info and activism, Dean.
     
  6. no worries

    no worries Member

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    Good info Dean, thanks!
     
  7. mapex99

    mapex99 New Member

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    "Close hawk drop", I didn't think that trail was legal...
    Thanks for the update!
     
  8. dstepper

    dstepper (R.I.P.) Over the hill

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    Hawk drop is not legal. Illegal trails are part of the inventory that goes toward calculating percentage of land use to be used for trails. Closing and block some trail gives them a argument to keep other trails in use.

    Dean
     
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  9. Chopper

    Chopper The Ancient One

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    You realized that El Moro is a State Park right? That's a whole different bag of beans than LCWP and Aliso Wood.
    I don't think anyone will be building any legal fall line trails there.
    On that note. How do you make a fall line trail sustainable? Or do you just trash it then build another one.
     
  10. dstepper

    dstepper (R.I.P.) Over the hill

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    Yes I'm know that El Moro is a state plan but it comes under the oversight of the new coalition that Hallie is working to coordinate. Fall line trails are not sustainable but Hailie acknowledges the appeal that some like to ride those trails. My point was a change in attitude not fine tuning details.

    Dean
     
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  11. Chopper

    Chopper The Ancient One

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    Dean, let me assure you that my intention is not to dispute what you heard at the meeting. There may just be some confusion about jurisdictions. I sent your post to a very reliable source, actually 100% reliable, and I was assured that LCF has absolutely no role in trail planning in El Moro.
     
  12. Chopper

    Chopper The Ancient One

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    Now let me tell you how I feel about unsustainable fall line trails. The picture attached is from El Moro at the first turn on East Cut Across where people decided to just take a short cut to Moro Canyon down the fall line. I wonder how long it will take for the hillside to collapse.
     

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  13. kioti

    kioti Active Member

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    ^^Someone ought to fill that thing in and put a berm above it.
     
  14. Chopper

    Chopper The Ancient One

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    Then be prepared to do that again every time it rains. Shouldn't be a problem.
     
  15. kioti

    kioti Active Member

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    Not trying to start a fight. It's just that some fall line slopes can sustain a trail (such as the ridge line trails in James Dilley), some require periodic maintenance, and some are no bueno. The soil in this photo looks too soft to be sustainable, but I've seen fall line trails that seem to hold up well over extended periods of time.

    Another thing I've seen is a general lack of maintenance which fails to address problems as they arise, and I'm talking about situations like the one in your photo (but am in no way blaming you), or the formation of p-lines causing ridiculous widening of otherwise perfectly fine trails. "Rock-it" comes to mind. It's unfortunate that more of us don't volunteer to help keep our trails narrow and repair damage as it occurs. LCF may be able to help with this, but mountain biking, like skiing and snow boarding, would be greatly diminished if we couldn't experience the joy of pointing ourselves down the fall line once in awhile.
     
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  16. Chopper

    Chopper The Ancient One

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    I couldn't agree with you more. Rattlesnake comes to mind. It's pretty much a fall line trail but it has a rock base. Unfortunately those without the skills to ride it continue to skirt the technical line making the trail wider while destroying the habitat.
    Regarding the gash in the picture, no one is going to maintain that. Any time I use to maintain illegal trails is just time taken away from maintaining the legal ones. I'm just going to watch it self destruct.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2015
  17. dstepper

    dstepper (R.I.P.) Over the hill

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    I am not defending fall line trails. I know Hallie has no say in El Moro. Her goal is to have a collaborative relationship to develop loops trails, suggested loops and maps that show all the parks and how they can inter connect. I try to post a positive message and the reality crowd rains on the parade. Hallie and the foundation have money and they have two full time employes designated to trail repair and development...she should be supported. No wonder I never try to help the MTBing crowd.
    Dean
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2015
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  18. kioti

    kioti Active Member

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    Chopper, that's the sort of repair that can be done by an unskilled crew with the guidance of a knowledgeable supervisor. The park ranger should probably handle it since it could get a lot worse this winter and impact Moro Canyon. As a volunteer, you should be free to work on more interesting, or complicated, problems that utilize your long-term experience in the park.

    And Dean, I wholeheartedly agree with your statement, "Lets hope we do better in Laguna than Ladera Ranch and Rose Canyon faired against OCTA." I believe the practice of locking long-time recreational users out of legitimate trails, such as Lower Joplin, in order to mitigate urban transportation impacts is misguided at best. The more crowded the county gets, the more we need these natural places to unwind.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2015
  19. Chopper

    Chopper The Ancient One

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    You seem to have misunderstood my intention. I just want to make sure information disseminated is accurate and clear. In your OP you stated that They are open to make some fall line trails legal. In your next sentence you indicated that this included El Moro. That makes it sound like they somehow have authority to make decisions about trails in El Moro when they do not.
     
  20. MnMDan

    MnMDan Member

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    Nice to see STR is back as it was. Move forward. We all have the same goal. Maintain, and develop sustainable trails where possible. Chip in, and those with authorization and the know-how have a responsibility to ensure those who want to help in this goal, do so in a way that allows for sustainable access.
     
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