New "Do Not Enter" Sign on Ladera Ridge, aka Lower Chiquita Ridge

Discussion in 'Trailhead' started by kingaucho, Apr 15, 2014.

  1. dstepper

    dstepper Over the hill

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    Blocking off a trail is one thing, using barbwire when bailing wire would do the same thing invites a lawsuit. The tape police use should be put there also. Barbwire is very hard to see in the dark. From taking to people in the know these requests are coming from fish and game. Much of that property was exchanged and put into nature preserve in exchange to build the toll road.

    Dean
     
  2. FijiRob

    FijiRob Member

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    Dean - We've heard lots of stories but Rancho Mission Viejo pretty much took ownership and stated they blocked the trail use because of the gnatcatcher. The press release can be read here. http://ranchomissionviejo.com/blog/chiquita-ridge-protection/ In the article they state they requested O'Neill Regional Park close the trails that were providing ACCESS to the trail that was built illegally that traverses down to Tesoro High School. The root of the problem was the off-shoot so why close the trail that has been there for decades makes no sense. Just barb wire the off shoot and be done. It sure would be nice to hear what the Rangers at O'Neill think about all of this.

     
  3. dstepper

    dstepper Over the hill

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    And who puts pressure on about the gnatcatcher...fish and game. RMV likes to develop the land and/or collect taxes.
     
  4. BajaWaldo

    BajaWaldo New Member

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    As of today, they "re-barbed" The Rage that runs down to Antonio (west off
    the ridge)... No Bueno

    I also rode Water Works & it looks like they added/extended quite a bit more barbed wire onto the existing wire (both sides)... Not blocking but keeping riders on the trail more I guess...
     
  5. BajaWaldo

    BajaWaldo New Member

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    rage.jpeg
    Rage fencing
     
  6. dstepper

    dstepper Over the hill

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    I hate to say this but I hope a deer or coyote gets tangled in that mess to prove how fixing one problem creates another. No caution tape on barb wire amazing.
     
  7. dfioc

    dfioc Quack Attack!

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    This is really dangerous. This wiring would be invisible at night. There should be a sign or placard across the trail opening as more of a visual cue. It could be a rider that gets caught in this. Lawsuit waiting to happen.
     
  8. scottywc

    scottywc New Member

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    Court me in.
     
  9. BajaWaldo

    BajaWaldo New Member

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    ^^^I'm in too^^^
     
  10. DLM

    DLM El Ciclon

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    Any updates on this? Rode the ridge this a.m. and was sorely disappointed to see the opening of Rage blocked off. Bah!!!! Had to turn around and take the single track down to the fire station, which begs the question, why is that trail still open given all the recent closures we've seen?
     
  11. GrampyGear

    GrampyGear New Member

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    It's part of the official Ladera Ranch trail plan. If you search "Ladera Ranch trail map," you should find an image of the official trail map, which shows the trail behind the fire station on a red loop along the eastern edge of town.

    A Ladera resident myself, I've been reading through this thread with interest and disgust since a few weeks ago when my wife and I took a ride up the ridge toward Oso Pkwy to do a loop with Waterworks in the middle. We're new to biking, and have been enjoying exploring the trails surrounding Ladera. I scouted the ridge trail on Google Maps, which clearly has it marked as a biking trail, and set off for a fun ride.

    The trail north from the apartments in Ladera was wide open, with no sign of closure (save the fence across what I didn't know at the time was The Rage). We met several bikers and a couple of joggers heading both directions up and down the ridge. When we descended to Oso, I turned around to watch my wife make the final descent to the sidewalk, and saw for the first time the sign declaring the trail off-limits, with violators subject to fine! WTH?!? We saw NOTHING coming up from the south. Entrapment, anyone?!? I was seething with anger the whole trip back, and found this thread after searching for some answers.

    This is the kind of nonsense that can really make a resident despise their local government. Close a trail, if you absolutely must appease a politically-powerful business... Fine, I guess that's how power and politics works. But to set up traps like near-invisible barbed wire on well-used paths, and "gotcha" signs that don't warn riders until AFTER they've apparently violated the law? That's just sadistic power-tripping, and the kind of stuff that enrages residents to the point of organizing.
     
  12. DLM

    DLM El Ciclon

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    I wanted to see if this section was still closed off and was pleasantly surprised to see the fence wide open and no "No Trespassing" signs. Suffice it to say, I once again enjoyed the ride down. Anyone know if this was a legitimate re-opening?
     
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  13. no worries

    no worries Member

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    I only just started exploring Arroyo Trabuco from my house in MV.

    Is there any update on all of this? Can I climb Oso to access the Ridge, cut across and drop Rage back to Antonio before doing Waterworks to head back home?
     
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  14. Kreature

    Kreature Member

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    Yes, no worries, you can do so. There are a few very short fence sections (atop Oso and at the base of Rage) to swerve around, but it's mostly wide open now, and easily rideable. Seems like some fencing and signage was removed, and trails slightly re-routed.
     
  15. da big hills

    da big hills happy night trails

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    "I rode a trail that dropped down to a main avenue that looked exactly like the one on the photo. It was uncanny. It even had all the same wildflowers.
    After popping a few curbs and center divider it climbed 300 feet out the other side, I made it an out and back. The trail ran a ridge for about an hour, lots of climbing, most not too step, it ended up riding like a climb both ways. All single track, you ride the flow and hammer back to another climb, sweet.
    You guys must have lost a gem.
    Sorry for your loss"

    That was me back in 2014, I knew that the closure could not last. There is not enough manpower to keep it in force. The trail I was quoting above is in Dos Vientos. It is part of the link trail system I did a ride report on in August. Although we did not ride this actual trail in August. This trail is the longest of the link trails
    Happy restored single track access.
     
  16. da big hills

    da big hills happy night trails

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    I also posted this earlier in April 2014....
    Note: being a night rider I found it very offensive

    It would not apply to me, when I find barbed wire I turn around or find an alternate path. Crossing a fence line would be tresspassing. The good news: what goes back up must come down again somewhere else.

    BUT I must ask: Why would anyone put a paddle in the center of a trail? Why would anyone put up BARBED WIRE across a trail? That is sick, really sick. I can just imagine finding that at high speed in the darkness, my goodness they did not even put on reflectors.

    Happy trails in the darkness.
     
  17. jeskandarian

    jeskandarian New Member

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    I stumbled upon this thread while investigating land ownership of the ridge trail after being approached by a few suits in a pickup this week while on the run I've been doing for 12+ years on this trail. I really hope the "trail construction crew" is on this thread.

    To be clear I'm talking about the trail as it leaves Oso (O s o parkway) and continues generally on or very near the ridge up to the antenna above the Kohls shopping center (approx). Also including the descents from this trail down to Antonio and the Fire station

    Some facts that I've established with the county:
    • The trail was never authorized for recreational use by the county. Ever. So you can ignore Google or anything published by anyone other than the county. It's a decommissioned ranch road that's owned partially by the county.
    • The trail crosses into Rancho Mission Viejo's twice. (No, I'm not talking about all of the newly cut trails. Just the long-ago established ridge trail). I've seen the property lines on a satellite photo. The first time it crosses is near the top of the initial climb for what seems like a few hundred yards and then once more later for a short period.
    • The county and RMVC have been well aware of the use of this trail forever but they looked the other way since the usage was "very low key" (a direct quote from the county).

    Unfortunately someone (a large group of someones?) decided it would be a good idea to go cutting a bunch of new trails. Both on the County-owned West side (stupid move #1) and RMVC owned East side ( an order of magnitude more stupid. We'll call this stupid move #2 thru #20).

    Nice job idiots.

    What you think are just new fun trails are characterized by the property owners as (these are direct quotes):
    • "new routes" were cut
    • "vandalism/cut fencing"
    • "structure installations (bridges)"
    • "cut vegetation"

    You guys should really start a new web site or write book and call it "How to lose an absolutely wonderful, mostly single track trail in one simple step".

    I've been running and biking here for a long time. With the additional trail cutting encroachment on RVMC property you can be sure they will not give up until access to this trail is shut down. RVMC has extremely strict wildlife regulatory standards they need to abide by. And they can't just throw up their hands and say "well, we can't help it if some dummies uprooted a couple hundred plants". They HAVE to abide by those agreed to standards or jeopardize their entire development effort. They have money, dedicated resources and lawyers on their side.

    Just because you think "well they cut up hundreds of acres of land, what effect can my trail possibly have?" doesn't mean ANYTHING except to you and your buddies. Do you have any idea how many years of studies, proposals, meetings and expense they go thru to be allowed to carve 100s of acres? In exchange they MUST maintain what's left. The people you and I elected into office make sure of that.

    I'm fairly certain this trail will now be entirely shut down and probably patrolled in a similar manner to the trails next to the 241. RVMC has a nice access road from their side so a pickup can get up there in just a couple minutes.

    I'm going to do what I can to start the process with the county to make this an actual recognized trail but the chances of it actually happening are very slim with the trail going onto RVMC land multiple times. They've seen what a bunch of irresponsible fools use the trail and the last thing they need is to risk their 1000+ homes or whatever they are building for the next 10 years just to appease some local residents who can't appreciate what they have.

    In summary: Thanks idiots.

    I've run and ridden that trail 3-4 times a week for nearly a dozen years. I've never veered off of the single track and I was perfectly happy with it. We were lucky to have some single track we could RIDE TO where the property owners looked the other way. Even for night riding. It would have continued that way indefinitely had a few dummies not ruined it.

    And if you think going to a meeting or two is going to have any effect you're mistaken. Cutting new trails in an already illegal area and on a developer's private property already set the tone that no amount of meeting attendance is going to fix.

    I hope you guys enjoy the little time you have with your new trails. I'll be sad to see my little slice of solitude taken away from me.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
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  18. trailninja

    trailninja Going Slideways!!!! Staff Member

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    Not bad for the 1st post. Pix or it didn't happen! Haha. This could be rant of the year on STR. Thanks for sharing. ;)

    So did you actually see trail builders cutting new lines or is that just your assumption? I recently read somewhere that a local community put in over 2500 man hrs building new trails. Never ridden in Ladera.
     
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  19. jeskandarian

    jeskandarian New Member

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    I've run what I think are all of the new "trails". It looks like it was a LOT of work. Most of them on the West side are fairly well scratched into the hill but aren't very well 'manicured' (narrow, off camber, not packed very well, questionable lines). Seeing hundreds of bushes uprooted was just depressing because I knew what it meant.

    The East side on RMV property range from what look like a fairly established ridge trail to just plain stupid straight fall line silliness.

    I didn't see anyone actually doing the work but I know that place like my back yard and they are all very recent. I tend to run it at lunch or before sunrise to avoid the crowds.

    If someone told me they put in 2500 man hours I wouldn't doubt it. I was both impressed by the quantity of work and quantity of cluelessness required. Every step of the way I was putting myself in the Rangers's shoes (or RMV's shoes on the East side) imagining what they must be thinking.

    The tone in the Ranger's communication was really astonishment that people could be so stupid.

    No, no photos. My guess is the last thing we need is even more ammo for the people with the money, resources and reasons to shut us out of this formally hidden small gem of a trail.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2016
  20. BigTex

    BigTex Member

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    Do you need to actually see someone cut new lines to believe they're there? Do you think bench cuts happen naturally?

    You call it a rant, but you've never ridden in Ladera. For those of us who live here and ride that trail regularly, it's kind of significant.

    I've ridden the West side trails, someone has put in a lot of work. It has potential. And, yes, the county will look the other way to an extent. I have stayed off the trails that drop into RMV property because I already knew RMV was pissed. Poaching on private land is stupid, plain and simple.

    So is building in an area that is clearly marked "Habitat Restoration Area - Keep Out". But the people working on Waterworks don't seem to care. And so we will probably lose that trail - which the county has willfully turned a blind eye to until now - also.

    I was unaware that the Ladera Ridge trail itself crossed onto RMV property. That's too bad, as it gives them legal standing to shut it down. Of course, if the idiots hadn't built trails that went well into RMV property, it probably wouldn't be an issue, just like it wasn't an issue for years until that started.

    For the record, the portion of Ladera Ridge from Firehose to the south (and Firehose itself) is part of the Ladera Ranch Trail system. Unfortunately, the fun, singletrack portion is the part that goes north from Firehose.
     
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