MmmmmMeadows!

Discussion in 'Trail Conditions' started by herzalot, Mar 9, 2013.

  1. MohammedInABearSuit

    MohammedInABearSuit Sticks and Stones...

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    Was out with Kioti and the crew Sunday AM brushing meadows...It has been several years since I last saw Meadows. Was one of the STR invasion days as I remember.

    I cannot believe how destroyed this trail is now!!! The number of cut lines in unbelievable and the whole ambiance of the trail is lost. Not to mention all the braking bumps.

    If people will stay on the trail and we continue to work on it my guess is that it will take 5 years to get it back to where is was 3 years ago and that isn't even as nice as it was 5 years ago.
    What I don't understand is that there are plenty of other trails that head more straight down (like Rock-It, Car Wreck and Mentally Sensitive) so what it the attraction?

    It was really very sad for me to see how this area has gotten destroyed. Not just the bikers but the hikers too. Saw a hiker walk right up a cut-a-cross below where we were working. One of the others n the crew saw a cyclist do the same headed down...
     
  2. commplex

    commplex SSuper SSlacker

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    ^ Dude! You should have seen it before the crew started working on it. I was beginning to think brake bumps were the new Black.

    Nice working/meeting some of you yesterday. I will ride it wednesday morning to test the sight lines that were created.

    oh and mark... you gotta get out and ride once the project is completed.
     
  3. ridinrox

    ridinrox Well-Known Member

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    Didn't feel like I contributed very much yesterday but I did enjoy the hike down and up Meadows, oh, and my hamstrings thank you too, Jim. :?:
     
  4. dstepper

    dstepper (R.I.P.) Over the hill

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    Roxy as we talked about yesterday AM, just getting out there and signing the county waivers shows we are good stewards and care to give back. OC Park Trails are just overused no getting around it....to many bikes on not enough trails. After the trail work I took the group on a short walk on a social trail to show them what meadows used to looked like.
     
  5. herzalot

    herzalot Well-Known Member

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    Mark - great to see you again. Despite its appearance, I believe Meadows rides better now that it has in the past 7 years - especially if you stick to the trail and do not cut. The cut lines and broken fences have disrupted the ambience, and that is why we wanted to modernize the trail - to make it so flowy and fun that nobody on a bike will want to cut the corners.

    You ask what is the attraction? In a word - flow. Crawling down Mentally Sensitive is a challenge, but it is not necessarily fun - like giddy little kid fun. Meadows is, especially now. My typical Aliso day includes descents down Rock-It, 5-Oaks, Lynx and Meadows, with the necessary climbs to get there. Each trail has a different character, but they all have some flow to them.

    Maybe it's the evolution (or de-evolution) of mounting biking. When long travel bikes appeared on the scene, the interest was straight down the hill, rocky, steep, nasty challenges. Then Whistler built A-Line, and the mountain bike world changed. Compare Karpiel at Northstar to Livewire. But it's not just at ski areas/bike parks. Check out Paradise Royale in Humboldt county or a hundred other IMBA trails. Modern trail building includes berms and turns for a more swoopy, less interrupted feel. Flow is its own fun. And Meadows, thanks to Kioti and crew, now has flow. The beauty is, you don't really even need suspension to enjoy it!

    Thanks again for taking the time to come work on this gem. I hope the fences and cut lines disappear, but truth is, with such increased usage, hikers will still cut corners to limit their exposure to bikes.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 25, 2013
  6. onlyzenki

    onlyzenki New Member

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    how to do i get to the start of meadows from say....the top of mathis ?
     
  7. shawndoh

    shawndoh New Member

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    For what it's worth, sometimes trail behavior is based on a lack of education. I have used the cut-lines a couple times when climbing Meadows. Seemed like a good idea at the time. Guess I won't do that anymore
     
  8. MohammedInABearSuit

    MohammedInABearSuit Sticks and Stones...

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    Meadows always had some flow. That is why I don't understand the need to ride straight down.
     
  9. templar

    templar Member

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    From Mathis continue climbing to Top of the World, TOW (also know. As Alta Laguna park). From TOW head toward the street and stay on Alta Laguna Blvd till right before a gated Community on the right (and before it does a dog left) there will be a dirt trail to the right. If you pass the gated Community you've gone to far. The trail is short but steep and heavily rutted so be careful on the decent. Once you climb out, there will be a paved road, follow the road down and up, and you will see the Meadows trailhead to your left.
     
  10. onlyzenki

    onlyzenki New Member

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    Thanks! ^^
     
  11. kioti

    kioti Active Member

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    I don't understand the question.
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    Using shortcuts is perfectly understandable when they're as well-established as the main trail, and there's a natural impulse to find the most efficient line. One of our goals is to clearly define a narrowed version of the current trail to help the area recover.

    I've heard trails described as scars on the land, but I don't feel that way unless they're poorly designed or neglected. Meadows has good bones and is a beautiful trail that just needs some well-deserved TLC. My thanks again to all who are giving their time and energy to make this happen.

    I've asked hikers why they were hiking the fall line and they said because there's a trail. Once there's a trail, people will use it. The hillside is not all that steep, and it's quicker for hikers to walk across a field of grass than all the way out to a turn and back. Riders use them, too, but Herzalot is right about hikers also wanting to be away from cyclists.

    A good example of this is the difference between summer backpacking and winter mountaineering. The Mt. Whitney trail has something like 99 well-graded switchbacks leading to the summit ridge. Summertime hikers use the trail because it's the most efficient way up over steep granite and talus. Winter mountaineers kick step straight up the snowfield because it's simple and direct. Spring skiers and boarders take any line down they're comfortable with, from kick turn and traverse, to jump turns to tucks down the fall line.

    Meadows has to accommodate up and downhill use by hikers, trail runners and cyclists of all skill levels and desires. Without thick brush or barricades, it's inevitable users will find the route that best serves their needs.
     
  12. ladera Dave

    ladera Dave New Member

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    I did trail work with Jim on the Luge, he is a great guy. keep up the good work.
     
  13. no worries

    no worries Member

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    Rode Meadows yesterday and just wanted to come back and thank the trail workers here again. What a transformation! Everything has held up great, you can really flow across this trail. I wish it were less of a trek to get to, but it makes for quite the hidden gem. If you haven't ridden this since the trailwork back in March, get to it.
     
  14. bvader

    bvader Long Live The Gorn!

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    I second that... thanks!
     
  15. Waldo

    Waldo Lebowski Urban Achiever

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    No worries - thanks for the reminder. I'd also meant to post that I finally got a chance to ride it again a couple weeks ago and loved it. I've always enjoyed Meadows a lot, but with the extra berms and some tread work I thought it was the best I've seen it in a long time. Less braking bumps and more flow = great fun, plus it seems like it's becoming a more sustainable design in some key areas. Big props to the folks who did the work, and I hope I can pitch in next time.

    The one big bummer though was seeing the explosion of idiotic bootleg lines that have been cut, from people cutting corners to knuckleheads simply ignoring the trail and shortcutting in straight lines up & down the hill. I don't understand that at all: If people want to hike or ride straight up or down the fall line, there are plenty of places to do that. The beauty of Meadows is in the constant swopping turns and great flow. I know it's a human nature thing, but I sure hope that the rangers and volunteer groups can find a way to stop this before they decide they just have to close off the whole area for restoration.
     
  16. dcrfx

    dcrfx Member

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    Rode it this morning, my favorite in the park. Part of the idea (if I remember right) was to make it so fun and flowy that no one on a bike would want to ride the boring fall line.
     
  17. Waldo

    Waldo Lebowski Urban Achiever

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    Not to point fingers, but I'm not sure that all (or even very many) of the "Straight-off Adolph" lines are due to bikes. The turns that have been cut from 2' wide to 6' wide are definitely due in large part to bikes though.
     
  18. ridinrox

    ridinrox Well-Known Member

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    Not to point fingers but I'm going to anyways: I hate when people use that expression bc it's basically what you are doing. Just cut to the chase and admit you are pointing fingers. :lol:

    *Disclaimer*
    It's too hot to do anything so I'm trolling...lol
     
  19. Garrett

    Garrett Active Member

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    Meadows is in all-time condition right now. The berms are nicely packed down and the dirt is tacky. hit it while it's fresh!
     
  20. me and my bike

    me and my bike New Member

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    Where art though kioti???
     

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