Rock the Vote - Prop 8, YES/NO?(Threads merged)

You must have heard that in one of those commercials, never believe the commercials. They ALL lie!

 

Why are you so bitter? What you have against the mormons?

 

Schlepp, you mentioned all the previous bullet points as shameful, how can you not see this one in the same light?

apples to apples if you ask me.

 

Rights are not granted, they are only ever taken away.

Privileges are granted.

The Constitution does not grant rights, it only protects them.

If domestic partnerships were completely equal to marriage then nobody would be hung up on the word marriage.

Being recognized as completely equal to marriage means being able to use the word, if using the word didn't matter, nobody would be defending it.

I have a question, if recognition of marriage was removed completely from the state constitution and every union was recognized solely as a "domestic partnership" with the use of the word "marriage" applied only to religious, non binding institutions, would anybody have a problem with that?

My bet is yeah, they sure as hell would, but I'm willing to bet that everyone arguing that "domestic partnerships are equal to marriage" would be protesting that change like you wouldn't ****ing believe.

 

Justin, check my post on the previous page, that may shed some light. If not let me know.

 

Well Dirtvert, the very group you've been disparaging had "rights" taken away. Do you remember that the Mormons at one time in their past practiced polygamy. It wasnt against the law when it was started. But the govt decided they needed to put down the Mormons and they outlawed polygamy. And as quoted here so many times, it was adults, consenting adults doing what they wanted. Whats so wrong with that?

Isn't it ironic that you've put them down so much when in fact they'd be the only group in the US that may have some understanding and compassion towards this situation? Too funny.

And by the way, there is no such thing as "Gay rights". Its just rights. Plain and simple. If not, then we are going to have to get separate rights for everyone. Gay rights, hetero rights, black rights, white rights, asian rights, mtn biker rights, road biker rights(a group that should also have not rights. jk), etc..

I voted yes on 8. I happen to be a christian. My decision had nothing to do with preserving the word "marriage" or keeping gays from enjoying the same benes i have. It was not based on hatred towards the lifestyle, the act, or any other thing about it.

I realize that banning "gay marriage" isnt going to stop gays from having gay sex. It wont stop gayness. It wont change a thing as has been mentioned in this thread so many times.

I voted yes strictly on the basis of keeping the ultra aggressive gay movement out of my kids school. I dispise the fact that the militant gay movement would use schools and the protection of the law to push its agenda in schools. Would you agree to have a religious person come into your kid's school and propagandize?

I want to keep that crap away from my kids as much as I want to keep hetero sex crap away from my kids. I limit what they watch & see as much as I can because I want them to have a good childhood without left wing or right wing jackasses pushing their crap on my kids.

So you can blame the militant gay movement for pushing my vote to yes. I really dont care what goes on behind closed doors. There is no doubt that the homo and hetero both have skeletons in the closet. The problem is no one wants to keep it there.

 

Since the Mormons financed a large chunk of the Yes on 8 campaign, you're either extremely ignorant or very disingenuous.

 

You missed the point. As a reader of history, especially US history, there isnt a group of people that have been treated so badly as the Mormons have in this country. Go pick up a book or google it. Of course there are some groups that will argue that and the only one I'd probably agree with is the Black american & indians.

Anyway, the Mormons have been kicked to the curb over and over since they came about. They had "rights" taken away. The govt sent an army to Utah to chase them down.

And now, the only group that could understand this movement is one of the groups that helped push it thru.

And to prove the point as to how the Mormons are treated, the march the other night went to the Mormon temple in LA first. So what do mobs do? They seek out a group they perceive is weaker and attack. The gay organizers know that America has it in for the Mormons, for whatever reason, and they'd try to garner strength and simpathy by attacking a group that is more hated than their own.

So once again, funny that the Mormons finally had a chance to stand for something they believe in and help get that passed. but lets not kid ourselves, they arent responsible for prop 8 passing. Make sure you attack all us Christians.

 

boludo

Nail meet head:bang:

Crazy how this Prop 8 topic is still hot.

It passed get over it. If you don't like it.... 2012..and vote again

 

Yeah, I'd have to agree that getting a de facto religious state established by a religious group that was founded by a crazy guy who liked to get a little on the side from his teenage housekeeper is much worse than the genocide the Indians faced or the slavery, Jim Crow years, and lynching that black people were subject to at various times over the course of United States history.

 

You make some good points. One part I'm confused about is the existance of a "militant gay movement". I have yet to see an example of militant action. In fact I moved unknowingly to a "gay" part of town just after school. To be honest Gay men seem to be the most unaggressive group of people I have ever encountered. You should consider meeting some actual gay people. It might put a face on what you clearly see as a general group.

It's funny what has been thought and done in the name of Jesus. Wait, actually it's not funny at all. I think if he were alive most of his day would be spent talking to people about how they are missing the point.

As for children I'm not sure they care. I mean, we're not talking about sex acts here. We're not even talking about politics. We're talking mostly about tax status and health insurance. I'm not sure kids would understand that anyway. If you're trying to teach your kids that gay doesn't exist you might as well try pushing back the ocean. Gay has been around forever. Teach your children core values and be flexible. You might have a gay son or daughter some day. It's nothing new. People are born different. Thats how the world works and if god made people it must be part of his plan. But that's all tribal pre-science nonsense anyway.

 

Good point!

I am out... Not that anyone cares!:lol:

 

I have news for a couple of you and I mean no ill will in telling you this but this is not a choice! My sexuality developed towards women when I was a child and I could not change that if I wanted too.
Just like your sexuality developed towards men or women when you were a child.
I don't ever expect you to understand because you can't. You are right and we are wrong. How sad is that!
Isn't it funny that I believe that if 3 or 4 or 5 people wanted to get married, and they were all consenting, then they should be allowed too.
Why do I see the big picture but so many of you don't?
Someday when one of your children comes to you trembling and terrified and says Daddy, I'm gay, ask yourself what you will do? Because it could happen.
I've lived my life gay because I had no choice and seen some real tragedy come from religious and human intolerance.
The child that says 'eww' to the teaching by you of gay people then develops self hatred if they find themselves leaning in that direction as their sexuality develops. You cannot stop it if it is going to happen.
I expect none of you to understand this because you live a life free of societal disdain but I sure wish some of you could walk a mile in our shoes.
And I'll bet some of you secretly do!

 

Once again, you missed the point. Go look it up and see how many men, women and children died.

And since you brought it up, the Mormons were thrown out of Missouri because they wanted to end slavery. They gave women the right to vote before the US did.

The only difference is that the Mormons choose to not let the past dictate their future. Which is why your ignorant response is ignorant.

Bigotry is bigotry whether its racial, religious, sexual, etc...

And one other history lesson. I know that there have been innumerable amounts of wrong done in the name of religion. But luckily I didnt have anything to do with it and wont be made to feel guilty about it. Just like I dont feel guilt over slavery. I never had a slave, never will, and none of my family either. But we do owe something to Christianity that never existed before it came about.

The word I speak of is compassion. The Jews didn't preach compassion. Islam didn't. Heathens didn't. So before that, it was kill or be killed. Hate anyone that was different.

Silver, i think you need a hug!

 

Prison

I have news for a couple of you and I mean no ill will in telling you this but this is not a choice!

Then why do they say "Gay for the stay" in prison:?:

ps. I agree with the rest of your post

I tend to think that some people are born gay and others are not (learned behavior).

 

Actually the Buddha Siddhartha Gautama taught compassion around 200 years before Christ was born. Just saying.

 

Buddha

Agree...........some scholars believe that JC's teachings were influenced by buddhism.........

 

damn you station. you're not helping.

ok, i'll give them the nod. But since Christianity is more wide spread i'm throwning points that way anyway.

if all of you sign my petition to make me king i'll make this all go away and make sure at least 70% of both sides is happy. Cant please everyone. :?:

 

Please keep it on topic, If you want to discuss religion, then start a new thread or use the message feature that you have to discuss THAT topic. Go off topic again and your post will be deleted.

Gene
STR Moderator.

 

Indeed.

"All the Arhats (Venerable Ones) of the past, present and future discourse, consuel, proclaim, propound and prescribe thus in unison: Do not injure, abuse, oppress, enslave, insult, torment, torture, or kill any creature or living being."

That is the basic premise of Jainism which dates back to at least 500 BC, so the argument that "before Christ, nobody taught compassion" is complete and utter bullshit.

It's also funny that even though Christ taught compassion, those who voted against Prop 8 feel no compassion at all to anyone who is different or doesn't believe in their particular god.

Instead we're to believe there is some kind of militant gay movement determined to turn all of our children gay.