PV: The axe is falling.....

[jonkranked]

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[roadkillross]

harsh

[jonkranked]

Originally Posted by roadkillross

harsh

Not gonna argue that. But I don't think I've ever encountered someone that is this much of a tool.

[deusxq]

so, did anyone go last night? I'm curious about the outcome, after all, I'd heard that E** was claiming someone hit her on a bike. Should have been interesting. Anyone who went, let us know!

[jonkranked]

Originally Posted by deusxq

so, did anyone go last night? I'm curious about the outcome, after all, I'd heard that E** was claiming someone hit it on a bike. Should have been interesting. Anyone who went, let us know!

I'll second this, I'm curious to the outcome as well. Sorry I couldn't make it, the dust hasn't quite settled from moving yet.

[roadkillross]

yeah man. ive met you and i think that i know your down for the cause. i kinda fallen out of the loop. i respect your judgement

[Burner]

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[jonkranked]

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[jonkranked]

Originally Posted by roadkillross

yeah man. ive met you and i think that i know your down for the cause. i kinda fallen out of the loop. i respect your judgement

wait... are you the ross that was on the trip to mammoth with gordon, leland, preston, myself and some others back in august?

[Burner]

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[Flat Broke]

Sorry guys, but I couldn't be there last night. Too many medical issues in the family (none in the immediate family thank God) which resulted in no one to watch my daughter and my subsequent absence.

If I could make a request; could we please kill the sideline bickering/arguing in this thread? It doesn't do anything positive for the issue at hand and at this point isn't even addressing issues related to the issue at Canyons/Del Cerro.

As soon as I get some info, I'll pass it along. On a side note, who gives a damn what E-- claims? It's not just the bikers that see her for the delusional nutjob that she is. We need to stick to what's important, and that's presenting a positive image of mountain biking, drill the facts about trail uses, saftey, and habitat and show up when we can to voice our opinions.

The public workshop on Saturday February 23rd will allow us to directly address the City Council. If ever there was a time or place you wanted to make a difference, that would be it. These people, while still politicians, aren't as consumed by their personal agendas with regard to trail uses at Del Cerro. Because of this, I hope that common sense and solid arguments based in fact will trump unsubstantiated claims and fabricated accounts perpetuated by those who aim to exlude us from the area.

Chris

[jonkranked]

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[drclark]

Only changes from last night was the elimination of Pillow Lava Edge trail due to sustainability issues and the addition of Grand Canyon as ped only. That wrapped up the del-cerro area. There were no motions to add any additional trails. The "three-sisters" area map was also affirmed (all trails multi use there). Overall the meeting was anti-climatic and not much else happened.

Next meeting is Jan 30. They will supposedly be discussing other uses within the preserve like the possibility of the funzone.

Also, the temporary closure (aka timeout) is supposed to go into effect by next monday. I know I post that after every meeting but this time it is supposedly for real. Apparently the delay was due to the $$ needed for the city to make signs. Pretty much the entire area with the exception of the fireroad will be closed. Noted that there are alot of equestrians that are pissed as the closure supposedly cuts off the community at the bottom of the hill from any trail access.

Enforcement will be mostly by self-policing. You can bet Eva & co. will be out there ready to snap pictures of any mtn-bikers not following the posted closures or defacing or removing the signs. Our compliance to the closure will be critical if we are to have a chance of successfully presenting our case before the city council for expanded bike access beyond what the PUMP committee is recommending. So hit it this weekend as it may be the very last time we will be able to ride our favorite trails & jumps legally.

Feb 23 is the public workshop with the city council. This is where we have to have a very strong showing. Eva seemed very concerned about what time the canyon's area would be dicussed that day. I expect she will be rallying as many anti-bike speakers as she can.

I will try to post a map when I get a chance but have been totally swamped at work since the holiday.

Later,
drc

[deusxq]

Originally Posted by Flat Broke

On a side note, who gives a damn what E-- claims? It's not just the bikers that see her for the delusional nutjob that she is.

In no way at all was I trying to add importance to Eva's opinion, I just figured it might have been kind of funny watching her mouth off about "getting hit" and no one else caring. She was always entertaining for ME to watch anyway. Looking forward to the big meeting so that we can try to get back our trails from unprejudiced officials. Thanks Doug for the report!

[roach]

Originally Posted by drclark

Only changes from last night was the elimination of Pillow Lava Edge trail due to sustainability issues and the addition of Grand Canyon as ped only.

Also, the temporary closure (aka timeout) is supposed to go into effect by next monday. I know I post that after every meeting but this time it is supposedly for real. Apparently the delay was due to the $$ needed for the city to make signs. Pretty much the entire area with the exception of the fireroad will be closed. Noted that there are alot of equestrians that are pissed as the closure supposedly cuts off the community at the bottom of the hill from any trail access.

Enforcement will be mostly by self-policing. You can bet Eva & co. will be out there ready to snap pictures of any mtn-bikers not following the posted closures or defacing or removing the signs. Our compliance to the closure will be critical if we are to have a chance of successfully presenting our case before the city council for expanded bike access beyond what the PUMP committee is recommending. So hit it this weekend as it may be the very last time we will be able to ride our favorite trails & jumps legally.

Later,
drc

Doug, you've done great work advocating cycling in this area. Anyone who rides mountain bikes owes you thanks (keeping up with all this crazy drama takes time!).

This next chapter at Del Cerro will most likely exacerbate the already heated anti-bicycle coalition. I'd say only about 60-70% of riders at Del Cerro even know the giant threat of closure is imminent. You can be sure that there will be a significant number of all users ignoring the closure(s) or pleading ignorance when confronted. I really believe the whole "timeout" thing is a gimmick to portray the MTB community as a bunch of anarchists who love to thumb their noses at authority.

The canyons is on the verge of full scale war (maybe I will have to start wearing a full-face helmet).
It won't matter if you're the son of hitler or Mother Teresa, if you're in possession of a bicycle off of Burma Road, you'll be counted as evidence for future mtb closures (3 sisters and Forrestal).

With the recent rains, many of the trails are already getting weeded over. Donor One is notorious for getting 6foot high mustard grass at the top. I assume that has influence on the time frame for the "time-out"?

Grand Canyon Ped Only? What a heavy loss. That trail has been the heart of the Canyons for over a decade. If anything, it's a great example of a steep trail that has been sustainable for many years (and fairly popular with mountain bikes). This is a crazy time, I almost wish I was oblivious to all the politics.

[jonkranked]

Originally Posted by roach

This next chapter at Del Cerro will most likely exacerbate the already heated anti-bicycle coalition. I'd say only about 60-70% of riders at Del Cerro even know the giant threat of closure is imminent. You can be sure that there will be a significant number of all users ignoring the closure(s) or pleading ignorance when confronted. I really believe the whole "timeout" thing is a gimmick to portray the MTB community as a bunch of anarchists who love to thumb their noses at authority.

I definitely have to agree here. I have this nagging doubt in the back of my mind that this whole "temporary closure" was intended to undermine any and all efforts by the cycling community - and to make cyclists out to be renegades hell bent on destroying nature (I wonder how large of an SUV Eva drives).

I'm sure that all use groups are going to violate this temporary closure. Only those who are up-to-date and in the loop already know the effective date of the closures (a small portion of all trail users at del Cerro). Its going to take time for word to spread to the remainder of the users (cyclists, pedestrians, and equestrians alike). I also have a hunch that there will be members of all use groups who disregard the closures even after they are aware of it.

Also, the anti-cycling contingent is going to use every scrap of evidence they can gather to prove that cyclists are violating the closures (in order to further their cause). Perhaps we should start collecting evidence as well to counter them, and show that all use groups are in violation (if this becomes the circumstances - I'm not advocating the fabrication of evidence).

[El Presidente]

Originally Posted by

1 Parking.
2 Who's gonna pay for construction of "ladders and drops"?
3 who will approve their structural integrity? Who will maintain?
4 Who is going to judge which stunt/drop is too high/big or not big enough?
5 Liability? The city will be ultimately liable, and we're supposed to convince the city council that a bunch of kids building stunts are responsible and there won't be any degradation of the environment?
6 the area is very small, but I guess that's not a big deal, since no real riders are expected to visit this area.
7 No habitat there?? the area looks just like all the area in the "nature preserve".
8 [B

Plenty of bike haters could use this proposed area as an excuse to close even more legitimate trails at Del Cerro. [/b](it's not hard to picture Eva scowling and stating "you don't need to ride trails, just go to the MTB area by the beach").

I'm sorry for being a POS. I'm sure many of the positive thinkers out there just want to pursue this idea to lock up as many of these brainless freeriders as possible and will see the above short list as "no big deal".

BTW, a previous post mentioned other successful free-ride parks (Seattle, Fresno, and New York). I hope people check em out. The one in Seattle is probably the funniest thing I've ever seen (it's under a freeway).

I can answer some of your questions:

Who is going to pay? Funds will come from grants, fundraisers and private donations.

The skills area will not be designed by a bunch of kids. It would be professionally designed. It could then be built by volunteers supervised by one or more professional.

Who will maintain it? The locals of course. On trail work days there have been 100 plus volunteers show up for a day of trail work! Obviously there is not a shortage of people willing to help out in the P.V. area!

Who will check structural integrity? The Skills Park will be built to IMBA's Standards.

Many real riders will ride the skills park! Just like they do in many other bike parks around the World! Riders of all levels can benefit from a skills park. You can improve your fitness, skills and have a great place to come out and ride with your kids! It will also be a place to educate riders on proper trail etiquette.

[gregg]

I just finished reading this whole thread. I haven't been riding up on the hill lately. I used to ride it all the time. I didn't know things were so bad. I want to thank everyone that worked so hard to try and keep this area open to all of us. I Am going to go ride up there tomorrow, hopefully not for the last time.
Thanks again everyone that went to the meetings...

[Sharky]

I just got home from being out there riding today...so far no closures. E** was out there walking around earlier making notes on a clipboard and the police went through on a golf cart. I might see ya thinking of maybe hitting it up again tomorrow. Not sure who else might go but I'll wear my STR jersey so say HI if ya see me. I can't stress enough how important the Feb. 23rd meeting with the city council is to those that ride there so please try to attend. Many thanks