Frickin Vinny!!

[xhuskr]

Astana Withdraws, Vino Suspended

here we go again!!!

Astana Withdraws, Vino Suspended
Versus - Tour de France
By Phil Liggett
July 24, 2007

Alexandre Vinokourov’s positive blood test announced Tuesday has stunned everyone from riders to organizers. Since his crash, he has been portrayed as a limping hero of what, so far, has been a marvellous Tour. Now, he seems to have been caught introducing homologous blood into his system just before the time trial he won in demonstrative fashion.

His Astana team has withdrawn at the invitation of the organizers and Vinokourov was suspended by Astana pending the confirmation of his positive test in his B analysis. It is very unusual for the second test not to confirm the first. In short, Vinokourov, one of the most respected riders in the peloton, will now leave the sport in disgrace.

British rider David Millar, himself a reformed drug taker, has been leading the campaign to clean up the sport. His comment during his own Saunier Duval team’s press conference in Pau, sums up the feelings of most: “I just feel like crying right now.”

Paul, Bob and I are, for once, speechless. We are all very upset with such a stupid action at a time the sport looked to be putting its own house in order. It is incomprehensible that Vinokourov could do such a thing when he must have known he was under suspicion because of his dealing with disgraced doctor Michele Ferrari in Italy. He must have known he would be tested at every opportunity and the time trial was the perfect occasion.

Tomorrow we will know more.
-----------------------------------------------
Will every tour be tainted now?!?

[tkblazer]

freakin roadies

[bjammin]

It sucks to get emotionally charged for someone only to have the "wizard" step from behind the screen.
What a disapointment!
Who's next?

[GOGrannyGO]

It's a surreal circus. Made for TV. One question, will it get more press than Lohan? I think that in today's TDF it's not who's doping, but who's getting caught. That, sadly, is shown again.

[PacMan]

You know, when you think about how much steroids and doping have changed the face of professional sports, it's amazing. I mean, Barry Bonds is set to break the all time homerun record--arguably one of the greatest records in all of sport--does anybody even care??

I hate what the last couple of year's has brought in the world of cycling. It's not going to make any new fans.

[CeeDubb]

'Roids won't make you a better hitter. You still have to put the bat to the ball. Isn't Mr. Bonds hitting better now that he's "clean?" I don't follow baseball, so I can kind of care less. I heard that most baseball players use steroids to decrease the likelihood of injuries or for injury recovery.

Anyway...here's an interesting read from Chris Carmichael:

[SIZE="5"]Say It Ain't So[/SIZE]
By Chris Carmichael

Say it ain't so. Tell me it isn't true that Alexander Vinokourov, one of cycling's biggest stars, tested positive for blood doping. This is not what cycling needs right now. The fans are tired of the scandals and losing faith in the sport. The sponsors are pulling out because they want positive PR, not positive dope tests tied to their brands. And the clean riders and coaches are fed up, too. But after we all get over our initial "Dammit, Vino!" reaction, there are a few things to remember:

1. His B-sample still needs to be tested.
   Though it's rare for a B-sample to show anything different from the A-sample (especially when you're looking at the blood of two people in one tube), it is possible that a mistake was made and Vino isn't guilty. The anti-doping procedures give an athlete or his representative the opportunity to be present when the B-sample is being tested, so you can confirm for yourself that the correct procedures were followed. In fairness to the athlete, we need to wait until the positive test results are confirmed by the B-sample before tying him up in the town square and flogging him.
2. Clean riders can and do win races.
   I've coached them, my coaches coach them, and countless other coaches and team directors have guided clean athletes to victories in the world's biggest sporting events. Doping scandals like this one hurt the credibility of the entire peloton, and it's the clean riders who bear the heaviest burden. They're struggling to win races against juiced competitors, fighting for fans' trust and respect, and hoping that someone else's poor decision doesn't end up costing them their jobs.
3. In the long run, catching cheaters is better for the sport
   In the short term, better testing procedures means a steady stream of doping scandals. There are a lot of people working to clean up our sport, and maybe if there's anything good about Vino testing positive it's that it shows that the testing procedures work. The governing bodies and labs are making it harder and harder for cheaters to keep their secrets. And if the sport survives through this tumultuous period, I think there's hope that one day large-scale doping scandals will be a thing of the past.

Interestingly, if he's guilty, Vinokourov will be one of the first riders who signed the UCI's "Riders' Commitment to a New Cycling" to test positive for doping. As a result, on top of the normal 2-year suspension, Vino would have to pay the UCI his entire 2007 salary. It's the first time the UCI has added a huge financial penalty to the fight against doping, and as a threat it may not have deterred Vino, but let's see what happens when riders start having to write big checks.

I've been involved in cycling for more than 30 years. The sport has treated me very well at times and kicked me in the teeth at others, but it's the sport I love and I'm in for the long haul. Cycling has made some great strides against doping in the past few years, but each "victory" comes at a high price. As coaches, athletes, teams, labs, and governing bodies work to clean up the sport, the world is watching and the race is on. If it takes too long, we'll be saving a sport no one cares about.

[PacMan]

Steroids will make you a more productive hitter. Bonds was always a hitter, just not a power hitter. His HR productivity has dropped sharply since he hit 73 in 2001.

[xhuskr]

Well said CeeDubb....let's hope the B sample will show something different. If not, it's turning in to the Tour de Dope'

innocent until proven guilty (unless your Lance?)

[CeeDubb]

Originally Posted by xhuskr

Well said CeeDubb....let's hope the B sample will show something different. If not, it's turning in to the Tour de Dope'

innocent until proven guilty (unless your Lance?)

Dude...Lance is operating on one nut. That's his get-out-of-jail-free card.

[xhuskr]

Originally Posted by CeeDubb

Dude...Lance is operating on one nut. That's his get-out-of-jail-free card.

I completely agree.....just wish the tour folk would. I'm tired of hearing about it........although it's been awhile (weeks?)

[CeeDubb]

What's the big deal on doping anyway? I guess I have to perfect my doping skills to increase my athletic performance...

I load up on Guinness all the time and it doesn't seem to help my race results. What am I doing wrong? I'm probably not drinking enough of it...

[foofighter]

Originally Posted by CeeDubb

now that's a stocked fridge...nothing but the finest mine would have some new castle in there as well

[CeeDubb]

Originally Posted by foofighter

now that's a stocked fridge...nothing but the finest mine would have some new castle in there as well

I used to be friends with Newcastle.

I wrote a break-up letter last year. Here it is:

Goodbye Newcastle

[foofighter]

LOL that's great i love the "dear john" letter

[GOGrannyGO]

Originally Posted by CeeDubb

I load up on Guinness all the time and it doesn't seem to help my race results. What am I doing wrong? I'm probably not drinking enough of it...

It needs to be IV.

[SAR_boats]

Back to the original topic...

This whole doping thing is really on my last nerve but not for the usual reasons. Personally, I really don't care whether or not the guys in the sport use EPO, or blood dope or whatever. I share the same convictions as a few others in that I just want to see them ride. As long as the substances they are using are legal (ie you could legally carry it on your person and not be arrested) then let them do it. The only reason why I say legal isn't because I care about the riders themselves, it is because they are looked upon as role models by children.

The reason why I am sick of the scandals is because of the politics behind the anti-doping commission. Any body want to take bets as to whether or not the next FRENCH rider that wins tests positive? Im guessing that he will be clean as a whistle.

I read in Bicycling the point/counterpoint of the Landis case and personally, I don't think WADA (world anti-doping adminisration) has a leg to stand on. But even IF every cyclist out there was jacked up on every performance enhancing drug out there, cycling is still a lot cleaner sport than baseball, or football, or basketball.

Ask any pro or semi pro football player out there and they will tell you that during games they are usually whacked out on pain-killers (and people think the stuff I carry in my pack is hardcore) it is amazing the things you can do when things like sore muscles, aching joints and broken bones don't affect you.

I really don't watch sports in general but I would much rather watch cycling or hockey than watch baseball or basketball. At least cyclists can form a cohesive sentence that is intelligent and well worded (as opposed to, for example, Shaq, who sounds like a brain dead moron)

Personally, I say let every pro atelete out there use whatever legal performance enhancing drug they want. They are the ones who have live with their bodies when they are 80

[Pho'dUp]

I hate how all these drug scandals are distractors from the sport. Also, coming from an pharm. analytical background, from what I've read regarding Landis, I do believe the testing procedure/protocols by WADA are definitely flawed.

But that being said, I am in favor of cycling efforts to clean up the sport. Cycling, and especially the Tour has a long history and failing to try to reclaim the sport's purity by not enforcing anti-doping policies is a big mistake. Look what it's doing to the baseball records. You can't just leave the floodgates open and have "anything" goes policy.

If so, cycling should then hire Vince McMahon to run the show because what you'd be left with is the WWF/WWE.

[2wheel_lee]

Adding to what SAR_boats said about these athletes being role models, it's unfortunate that our society is always looking for the easy way out: diet pills, blaming others (lawsuits) for their own stupidity, and "power" additives, etc. The doping scandals should be expected in the "get rich quick" society we live in.

And it's particularly bad for those who are legit winners in sports, as they fall into a catagory of "they just haven't been caught yet" mentality.

[2wheel_lee]

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