Electrolytes & You

[dubjay]

I seem to be engaged in an ongoing quest against cramps. Sometimes I get them - sometimes I don't.

I'm a big time salt sweater. My gloves, Halo, helmet straps and even my Wingnut can produce enough salt to flavor a few family sized meals.

Because of this, I've been trying to keep my electrolyte intake up during races. I'm currently using a Perpetuem/HEED mix (in a bottle) with 2-3 Endurolytes per hour in conjunction with normal water intake from my hydration pack. This seemed to work well during CC (~60-70 degrees) but not so well during the Traverse (100+ degrees)

So I'm wondering if I need to up the dosage of electrolytes - perhaps up to 6 Endurolytes per hour during warmer race days? Or even adding Elete, Nuun or Camelbak Elixir to my hydration pack?

Is there a downside to taking in too many electrolytes?

Any thoughts or experiences to share would be much appreciated.

-WJ

[BFloFoxRider.]

This isnt what you were looking for, but, when i took a few months break from racing XC, then went back into sport racing, i cramped up bad. Not because it was hard, but because my legs werent in good enough shape. Maybe you arent training enough for the riding you do? i've never met you so i dont know how much riding you do in fact do, but that was a point for me, i wasnt doing enough riding so i took 4-5 endurolytes an hour..

[BrewMaster]

From what I understand, which isn't much, cramps are not just about electrolytes. Too much electrolytes could cause you to retain water and feel bloated and sluggish, but it doesn't sound like you are at that point yet.

Most electrolytes would tend to swing your body's pH to the basic side. What's strange is that mustard, pickle juice, or other cramp busting remedies tend to be acidic (vinegar for the most part) but also contain electrolytes in the form of salt. I think there is something to this acid+electrolyte combination.

You could try adding lemon juice or straight citric acid to your ride drinks and see if that helps. There are other acidic additives you could try, but I think lemon or orange juice would be the best tasting choices.

I have no experience with this, but as a chemist, it makes sense to me.

[Jslow]

Brewmaster brings hefeweizen on rides and mixes with some citrus... seems like top secret doping to me?

I like some chili cheese fritos when I'm taking a rest. I think those keep the cramps away better than any pills.

[BrewMaster]

Originally Posted by Jslow

Brewmaster brings hefeweizen on rides and mixes with some citrus... seems like top secret doping to me?

No fruit in my hefeweizen. That's nasty. Plus, beer foams too much in the camelbak.

Originally Posted by Jslow

I like some chili cheese fritos when I'm taking a rest. I think those keep the cramps away better than any pills.

Vodka and a Jumbo Jack has kept cramps away for you as far as I have seen.

[mottmcfly]

Correct me if I'm worng but can't low potassium levels also cause cramping?

[BrewMaster]

Potassium would be counted among electrolytes.

[mottmcfly]

Originally Posted by BrewMaster

Potassium would be counted among electrolytes.

Didnt know that. thanks!

[ubermensch]

Originally Posted by dubjay

Is there a downside to taking in too many electrolytes?

I believe Mike Judge touched on that in his movie Idiocracy.

brought to you by carl's jr.

[Pho'dUp]

Originally Posted by mottmcfly

Correct me if I'm worng but can't low potassium levels also cause cramping?

Yes. That's why it's good to eat oranges and bananas prior to a long an event and even during as they're stocked full of potassium.

DubJ. If the Endurolytes aren't working, you may look into adjusting your diet prior to events or during eat more foods that are rich in electolytes, vitamins etc. Sourcing these things from food I have heard may assist in absorption and uptake better than just taking supplements.

Carl

[duke777]

So is the pickle juice remedy myth or truth? Does mustard really work on cramps?

I just think a nice big bowl of Pho with every animal parts and hot sauces is the ticket.....to bad you can't get it at your local McD's 5 in the morning.

[lardbutt]

I also sweat a lot during hot weather and literally cannot absorb water/electrolytes into my system as fast as I sweat them out. Doesn't matter how much I drink during exercise, if it is hot, I lose it faster than I absorb it. I MUST spend a couple days prior to a long ride/race preparing my body with hydration and nutrition otherwise come race day, things go badly. It is important to drink the right stuff for your body while you are exercising but for me at least, it is even more important to pre-load my system with all the goodies it needs before the event.

Chugging a bottle of gatorade in the parking lot just before the gun goes off just doesn't do it for me...

[Zippy]

The cause of cramps is still being discussed among exercise physiologsts and theories range from electolyte imbalance, physical fitness and pH imbalance (too acidic and your enzymes function poorly). The truth is probably a mixture of all of these theories.

I too am a heavy, salty sweater. I don't like endurolytes because of all the Vitamin B in them and because they're only sodium. Vitamin B helps your body liberate energy, but what's it doing in an electrolyte supplement? Shouldn't we be replacing lost potassium and calcium as well?

Chances are your boy works differently than mine, but here's what I've learned:

1) Mixing electrolytes in my drinks can make my stomach upset. If it's in a capsule form, that's how the manufacturer thinks you should take it.

2) I need a mixture of electrolytes and not just sodium, so I take more than one product.

3) I electrolye pre-load the night before and the morning of a hot race. I just started that this race season because of poor performances in the heat. Great results so far.

The end message is the same for all nutrition: trial and error. Good luck.

[sladnas]

I was going to post a long thing on this, but I'm not qualified enough to do so.

I will say that sodium and potassium are two electrolytes which are necessary (i.e,. required, must have, cannot do without) for life. They are used at the cellular level to (among other things) regulate water and wastes. If that process shuts down, you die.

The good news is that your body is very effective at keeping you alive, even under (temporarily) extreme, stressful conditions.

I recommend everyone take physiology 101 at your local college campus. It is time worth spent (and you don't need a background in biology or chemistry to understand the entry level course). It's also cool to do some introspection on your own body.

[Pho'dUp]

Originally Posted by sladnas

I was going to post a long thing on this, but I'm not qualified enough to do so.

I will say that sodium and potassium are two electrolytes which are necessary (i.e,. required, must have, cannot do without) for life. They are used at the cellular level to (among other things) regulate water and wastes. If that process shuts down, you die.

The good news is that your body is very effective at keeping you alive, even under (temporarily) extreme, stressful conditions.

I recommend everyone take physiology 101 at your local college campus. It is time worth spent (and you don't need a background in biology or chemistry to understand the entry level course). It's also cool to do some introspection on your own body.

Dubjay, I've got a human physio book at home if you want to do some not so light reading. Nice colorful pictures and diagrams. Haha, Just understand those are you're basically cool.

[mfoga]

Not sure if any of you guys have ever tried it but I know quite a few athletic trainers who have recommended Pedialyte. Yes the kids drink.

[foofighter]

i really think it has a lot to do w/ fitness level...case in point that last ride when Tinker was riding w/ just one small bottle of fluid and he was (from one account) barely breathing hard and mashing on big ring. He's at such a level of fitness that his body has somehow become accustomed to operate at that level? I dunno

[mp3]

What are cramps?
Actually, I'm lucky that I found something that works for me.

1. Train during the hottest part of the day once in awhile
2. Ride/race within my limits
3. Hydrate properly before and during a race
4. Drink enough liquids when having a gel or bar
5. Thermotabs - $6 for 100 and they work 10x better than Endurolytes imo.

Here's a pic of my nutrition setup for the Hurkey 24 hour race which was pretty hot
(note the bananas, salt & vinegar pringles and Thermotabs ):
http://enjoying-the-ride.blogspot.co.../extremes.html

Originally Posted by foofighter

i really think it has a lot to do w/ fitness level...case in point that last ride when Tinker was riding w/ just one small bottle of fluid and he was (from one account) barely breathing hard and mashing on big ring. He's at such a level of fitness that his body has somehow become accustomed to operate at that level? I dunno

I don't think he expected the very high temps and I believe he had to slow down quite a bit so as not to overheat. That's my take on why he didn't beat Manny's time from last year.