Jax, Fullerton

[spookydave]

Originally Posted by Jaydilinger

Alright, Thanks everyone for posting some objective stuff on here. I'd rather shop at jax than online so I can support my local bike shop. When you know the equipment I ride with you can judge if I can advance my cycling desires. For now I'm pretty happy on well equiped hard tail.

Ok man, I compete with mail order in the motor sports industry. Some times it seems that Summit and Jegs are trying to crush all of us little guys.

Jaxs is not the only local shop in the area. Why do you like it? Why should I go there over another local shop? If you are going to cheerlead for them that's great. Just tell us why.

As far as equipment, I don't give a rat’s ass if you ride a Huffy or a Dean. It's all about having fun riding to me.

I think the fully Jaxs has gotten better with the remodel. I used to have trouble getting waited on. I used to feel like I would just stand at the counter with my items and wait and wait. It happened more then once also. The first time I was stepping up in bikes. I had over 2K cash in my pocket. Oh well that worked out as I ended up spending it at SuperGo on a new Intense Tracer, still have it and still love it. But like I said, I have been going back lately and the service I get is much better. And that's good for me as I work right by there and use them for consumables like tubes and stuff.

All i'll tell you is that if you saw my bike there is a good chance you would think it's very nice. They will roll out the red carpet when you become a regular. And they impressed me to become a regular. I'm guessing this happens at other shops as well. I dont think people should bag on any shop for that matter. Appreciate them for what they are rather than criticizing for what they are not.

[ODB]

Originally Posted by Jaydilinger

Appreciate them for what they are rather than criticizing for what they are not.

Fair enough: I appreciate that the Fullerton store can't even keep basic presta-valve mountain tubes in stock on the floor, and the "help" there won't even offer to look in the back for any.

YES!!!! back to the negativity.

[guero]

Originally Posted by Jaydilinger

YES!!!! back to the negativity.

Keep in mind, this is ODB's experience he had at the shop...positive, or negative, that is why we have created the Bike Shop Review forums.

[2wheel_lee]

Originally Posted by Jaydilinger

YES!!!! back to the negativity.

As Guero said, our experiences are real.

The concept of giving good and bad recommendations for a particular vendor go back many centuries. The internet is just the latest means of offer recommendations - good and bad.

Many shops who offer good service welcome feedback regarding their own shops. And although they'd probably prefer not to read negative feedback about their competitors, they know that it confirms that the good shops are doing something right that the bad shops are not. It's what helps the good shops stand out.

Sometimes there is negative feedback about shops that are known to be good. And the truly good shops welcome the negative feedback and learn from it.

The bad shops who have no interest in our business will continue to do business that fits their model, and in this case, that's Jax. When it comes to the desires of riders on this board, the business model of Jax stores contradicts the interests of most STR members. That's the way of life.

I don't blame Dave for not catering to the enthusiast crowds. If you're not truly into the enthusiast aspect of cycling, such as shops like The Path, Adrenaline, and The Bike Co., then you'll surely fail - as Village was in the process of. Village was never truly a hardcore enthusiast shop. It was a typical GT concept shop, if I remember correctly.

But again, I can appreciate of chosing the type of customer you want and going after it. As I said, STR members are not the intended customers for Jax. I have a good friend who also has a couple large shops. He stays out of the high-end mtb stuff as well, since he says that he sells 100 $2000 Giants for every one Intense he sells (he was an Intense mtb dealer). He recently decided to drop Intense. However, his customers are still taken care of - they're not jacked around like we read about many Jax customers in this thread.

[TooManyTacos]

Wanted to add to this thread, since I've written about other places where I've shopped.

I just bought a Fisher Ferrous 29 at a GREAT price from Jax in Fullerton. I probably wouldn't have gone there at all if it wasn't such a good deal. Anyway, I called ahead to ensure that there was one in stock and then made the 30 mile drive over there. The bike was there as promised, and so was the person who I'd spoken with on the phone. I checked a few things on the bike, bought a new set of tires, and proceeded with the transaction. It took awhile since I used my Trek Credit card, but it was really hassle-free, and I walked out of there with the bike and my new tires.

I have nothing negative to say about my experience there. I've shopped at a lot of different places, and it seems true that different shops cater to different crowds. In this case, I knew exactly what I wanted and the price I was willing to pay; so I went there, paid the money, and went home. I didn't need any extra assistance from the store staff (for what it's worth though, most of them seemed very polite and competent) or any esoteric components that they didn't carry. I can understand the potential frustration if I DID need something not made by Trek.

Like I said, I usually buy my gear from other sources, but I gave Jax Fullerton a chance to sell me a bike and they did everything right. It might be different if I had a different level of knowledge about bikes or a special need, but since I didn't, I have to say "well done".

[kdog4130]

Originally Posted by 2wheel_lee

Yes. I was in Jax Fullerton about three weeks ago. Stocking a couple Dura-Ace or XTR parts does not mean they stock lots of enthusiast parts.

Avid, Hayes, Magura, or Shimano disc brake components? Nope
Spokes? Just a few non-butted sizes of spokes at Fullerton. Nothing good.
Handlebars? Bontrager, but that's about it.
MTB tires? Bontrager, no Kenda, Maxxis, or any of the other common brands (Bontrager tires are not enthusiast tires).
Wheels? Only the commone Bontrager, Mavic, or Shimano. Nothing unique.
Frames? None.
Forks? None.
Grips? Bontrager and Serfas (I think)
Pedals? Mostly roadie stuff (and a couple of the same Crank Bros stuff that REI sells).
Seat posts? Bontrager and a token Thomson posts. No selection of types, styles, colors, or sizes.
Seats? Bontrager.
Stems? No mtb stems, let alone selection.
Bicycle related clothing? Only a few off-brands. Limited brands, sizes, helmets, shoes, and no protection gear.

Small service parts for common parts for cranks, brakes, drivetrain? Are you kidding? But they'll offer to order it for you! Yeah, right. If I wanted to order it, I'd do so online (for a better price and quicker delivery).

I'm currently in the process of building a new BMX bike. There was absolutely nothing anybody would want on a BMX race bike. Sure, there were the token pegs and other cheapo street thrashing parts for the local groms, but nothing I could find useful. Coincidentally, I was near Jax Irvine about a month and a half ago, and it was the same.

Trek has some nice road bikes, but that's about it. By the way, I generally don't buy complete bikes. I usually build them up piece by piece - as many enthusiasts do. The Jax stores don't recognize these enthusiasts.

Enthusiasts like selection, and having basically one brand to choose from is not a selection. It may work for In N Out, but it doesn't address my wants. Sure, Jax may be profitable - trying to be another Performance - but don't confuse that goal with being a shop that enthusiasts want.

If you believe the Jax Fullerton, Irvine, or Yorba Linda (visited 2 months ago) stores stock a good selection of stuff for enthusiasts, you're a prime example of the ignorance those shops have. As I mentioned, I do all kinds of riding (although I could explain my MTB riding includes XC [sometimes geared, sometimes SS], DH, 4X, and AM), and Jax never has anything I need or want (but I still keep checking there).

Again, if I wanted a $359 Trek mtb or a beach cruiser, Jax may be a good store. After all, these customers typically don't know any better or have aspirations for any more. With these customers being the focus of the business, Jax will do well in this arena. Oh, and selling a few high-end Trek road bikes, does not make Jax a higher-end shop, either.

Sorry to beat up an old post Lee, but you say "Bontrager tires are not enthusiast tires" Would you care to elaborate on the reasoning behind that slighted statement? Does this mean i'm not an enthusiast anymore???? Oh no!!!!

[RacinJason]

Lee is right 100%

However, there is a place in the market for this kind of shop. It is a great place for entry level riders and people learning about mountain biking.

I think what Lee was trying to say is that like many others we know and ride with would never use Bontrager tires at Bootleg or Fontana or any other advanced rides.

Bontrager tires and accessories are stock OEM take off parts that most of us have laying around in our garages.

Again I'm not bashing. I just want to help.
I would love to see Jax carry high end bike parts.

Originally Posted by kdog4130

Sorry to beat up an old post Lee, but you say "Bontrager tires are not enthusiast tires" Would you care to elaborate on the reasoning behind that slighted statement? Does this mean i'm not an enthusiast anymore???? Oh no!!!!

[kdog4130]

Originally Posted by RacinJason

Lee is right 100%

However, there is a place in the market for this kind of shop. It is a great place for entry level riders and people learning about mountain biking.

I think what Lee was trying to say is that like many others we know and ride with would never use Bontrager tires at Bootleg or Fontana or any other advanced rides.

Bontrager tires and accessories are stock OEM take off parts that most of us have laying around in our garages.

Again I'm not bashing. I just want to help.
I would love to see Jax carry high end bike parts.

Jax does, carry high end parts. We do not have a case of King hubs, nor every color of Hope seat collar.

I do understand that you are not bashing, belive me. Bontrager parts do come on all Trek, Fisher and Klein bikes.....true. They are not all OEM take-off parts. This is where I disagree. My $800.00 Race X Lite wheels are far from OEM take off parts. Bontrager exists as a component company outside the Trek corporation. Their Carbon wheel systems are far from bland OEM parts.

Please understand I do realize that Bontrager is not the most popular brand on the market, and that's why I like their components, among other reasons. If I did not work for a Trek Dealer, I would still run their components over others. As I have for 6 years. I use their tires on many advanced rides, along with every other brand on the market.

I am just trying to understand the reasoning behind the strange attitude that many people have regarding their tires, components, and other bits. I understand if you experienced a problem with something branded Bontrager. Keith is still very involved with the design, and execution that goes into all of the high end components.

I have allways thought an enthusiast is ANYONE who loves riding, any kind of bike. Bontrager tires or not.

We do have "enthisiast" clients that frequent our stores, that are true MTB'ers like everyone here.

[RacinJason]

I understand you have high end and low end.
Many people feel a brand that comes on many entry level box bikes is more OEM. OEM is not a bad thing but it lacks some quality and character in some ways. OEM is a great thing it allows people to buy a bike and ride today affordably.
If OEM had so much character and it was so lite and high quality why would anyone buy after market parts. Building your bike the way you want is part of the fun.
From a design stand point the stock just don't stack up. I don't think I need to get into the points of engagement or types of bearings used etc.. But lets just say that there is a reasons for after market parts.
Show me a Bontrager tire that I can use for DH that will stick and I will hold up I might try it .
I can take a Wall mart Huffy on a DH course stock but that doesn't mean its a great bike.
I think what lee was trying to say is that it is two different markets. Entry level and enthusiast .
And maybe the fanatic. Who is the real enthusiast? Many people think they are if they read a MBA magazine. Some have 6-10 high end bikes they might be a bit of an enthusiast.
You might say I am. But maybe not Willie and I only have 7 bikes.
I am looking at getting a 5 inch XC bike. That Trek EVO looks nice but Jax would never let me Demo it so I will never know. I cant pay for a bike in full to demo it. But that is an interesting concept.
The regular bike trail bandit can test a bike in a parking lot . A real enthusiast has to to ride a bike on a trail.

I am only trying to help out.
My words are meant to be constructive.
PM or call me some time if you have questions.

I would be happy to help in any way I can.
I think Jax has a good thing.
Embrace it.

Originally Posted by kdog4130

Jax does, carry high end parts. We do not have a case of King hubs, nor every color of Hope seat collar.

I do understand that you are not bashing, belive me. Bontrager parts do come on all Trek, Fisher and Klein bikes.....true. They are not all OEM take-off parts. This is where I disagree. My $800.00 Race X Lite wheels are far from OEM take off parts. Bontrager exists as a component company outside the Trek corporation. Their Carbon wheel systems are far from bland OEM parts.

Please understand I do realize that Bontrager is not the most popular brand on the market, and that's why I like their components, among other reasons. If I did not work for a Trek Dealer, I would still run their components over others. As I have for 6 years. I use their tires on many advanced rides, along with every other brand on the market.

I am just trying to understand the reasoning behind the strange attitude that many people have regarding their tires, components, and other bits. I understand if you experienced a problem with something branded Bontrager. Keith is still very involved with the design, and execution that goes into all of the high end components.

I have allways thought an enthusiast is ANYONE who loves riding, any kind of bike. Bontrager tires or not.

We do have "enthisiast" clients that frequent our stores, that are true MTB'ers like everyone here.

[2wheel_lee]

kdog, I apologize. When I said enthusiast, I meant more of the hardcore enthusiast. You're correct: a lot of enthusiasts ride their bikes down the river trail and along the beach. These are not the people who I was referring to. The hardcore enthusiast I referred to are those who live for riding, who are critical about every part on their bike and want the best performing component that fits their price range, and on and on. I'd say most of the people who post regularly on this board are those who I'm referring to.

None - or very few - of these hardcore enthusiasts would chose Bontrager tires or components over the other available offers with one notable exception: They have a Trek, and only want to use products from that company. Specialized is in the same situation, except they've actually offered a few really good tires that many people like.

Otherwise, Jason pretty much covered it.

Oh, another problem with OEM stuff/brands, is that they can only be purchased or serviced at dealers of those brands. You can walk into any store and order Mavic wheels, Thomson stem, Chris King hubs, etc. You can also have any dealer warranty or service any of these parts (because they can all order small parts). And this doesn't take into consideration that Jax may not be a Trek dealer next year. Then you're out of luck. No one knows. I've seen this happen with many big brands and large dealers. However, you can warranty your Mavic wheel at most any shop.

[DeeZee]

Originally Posted by 2wheel_lee

kdog, I apologize. When I said enthusiast, I meant more of the hardcore enthusiast. You're correct: a lot of enthusiasts ride their bikes down the river trail and along the beach. These are not the people who I was referring to. The hardcore enthusiast I referred to are those who live for riding, who are critical about every part on their bike and want the best performing component that fits their price range, and on and on. I'd say most of the people who post regularly on this board are those who I'm referring to.

None - or very few - of these hardcore enthusiasts would chose Bontrager tires or components over the other available offers with one notable exception: They have a Trek, and only want to use products from that company. Specialized is in the same situation, except they've actually offered a few really good tires that many people like.

Otherwise, Jason pretty much covered it.

Oh, another problem with OEM stuff/brands, is that they can only be purchased or serviced at dealers of those brands. You can walk into any store and order Mavic wheels, Thomson stem, Chris King hubs, etc. You can also have any dealer warranty or service any of these parts (because they can all order small parts). And this doesn't take into consideration that Jax may not be a Trek dealer next year. Then you're out of luck. No one knows. I've seen this happen with many big brands and large dealers. However, you can warranty your Mavic wheel at most any shop.

Got to say I just picked up a set off Bonti Jones XR 29'er tires and they are great. Fast and light.

However I had to file down a Bonti stem this weekend to get it to tighten down correctlyThis is my "fit stem" that I use to see witch Thomson I need to buy